Last week gave us a number of reunions – Jack and Claire in the alternate timeline, and most notably Sun and Jin (finally) on Island. The storyline was advanced in a number of ways, including Jack’s initial cognizant interaction with MIB, along with Sayid seemingly returning from the dark-side, even if just for a moment. At the end of last week, we basically saw MIB pull Jack from the remnants of a missile explosion, which leads us to this week’s episode, another Jack-centric episode.
Synopsis
“Jack must decide whether or not to trust Locke after he is asked to follow through on a difficult task.”
LostBlog.net 
Yay, first one to post. Feels cool after all these years. Can not wait for tonight.
Oh, and totally excited about another Jack-centric episode. he has always been the hero.
I got chills when I saw the title and pic. This is really getting good. Can’t wait!
it’s not for another week though! this post got my hopes up that i’d been mis-informed. 😦
I am looking forward to this episode, but it’s not airing until NEXT week. Tonight is a rerun.
LOST for Dummies – by Tarzan
Tarzan make much worry for current conflict on Tarzan island.
Tarzan more worry now than ever in time – as Temple friends gone.
Tarzan most worry that Tarzan no place run, no place hide, and everyone carry firesticks that kill.
Tarzan make easy hiding from Hydra Island peoples that crawl from shiny metal fish.
Tarzan not hide easy when Hydra peoples use night binoculars and throw exploding coconuts from small island.
Tarzan want to make attack stop, but no can find canoe anymore in bad neighborhood.
Tarzan see old friend Science Sheriff Sawyer hurry through jungle with tribe mates.
Tarzan not sure why they let crazy yellow-hair girl with squirrel nest on head get on big white canoe with them.
Tarzan hear they say they go to Hydra Island, so slip into water and hold rope on nose of giant canoe.
Tarzan happy to sneak over to small island without group knowing, but sad when Doctor name Jack swim back.
Shark with science tattoo swim to Doctor name Jack, sniff and swim away – not normally eat hairiest of primates.
Tarzan barely remember what next… hear words “drop anchor”… then hit on head and drag to bottom of sea.
When Tarzan gain brain sense and use of eyeballs, Tarzan see Sawyer tribe kneel on beach without firesticks.
Tarzan stay quiet in water and hide behind giant white canoe.
Then Tarzan heart almost stop make blood when see evil island overlord has returned.
Tarzan know face of Chuck Widmore at any age… it only face that ever give Tarzan sleeping night dreams that scare Tarzan.
Tarzan now certain. No place run – no place hide – grand island battle soon begin.
Tarzan now consider defecting to tropical island name Canada, or sleep in Rose and Bernard guest room.
so it’s finally on… better be a good episode!
In my mind there have only been two bad episodes. Nikki and Paulo and Jack in the orient. Those might gain more meaning sometime soon.
Big Hucks predictions:
– Hugo will take Richard’s position.
– Aaron is a candidate as well
– Jack will be one of the finalist to take Jacob’s position, but total LOST’s twist of fate, the one chosen will be a total surprise
– Jin will reveal that he learned to speak English quickly (one episode quick) via the Rosetta Stone program
– Sawyer will finally cut that nappy hair and get a normal man’s hair style
Pre 2 cents:
1) cant believe only 5 hours of LOST left…no way they will answer everything!
2) I dont think the candidate is Hurley as many suggest I am guessing Desmond!
I keep thinking about the psychic, Richard Malkin and Aaron for several reasons. Think back about what he said to Claire on many occasions. “It is crucial that you yourself raise this child. This child parented by anyone else, anyone other than you…. Danger surrounds this baby. Your nature, your spirit, your goodness must be an influence in the development of this child. There is no happy life. Not for this child, not without you. You mustn’t allow another to raise your baby. The baby needs your protection! (from who or what?) Listen to me, I have a plan, something that will make this all better. (adoption by the nice couple in LA. The Widmores?)If you don’t do what I’m suggesting, great danger will befall……” (Aaron or the world?)
Later his daughter drowned, was in the water for 2 hours and was “resurrected” during the autopsy. Reminds me a bit of Sayid. Mr. Malkin tells (Priest) Mr.Eko that he makes a living as a psychic but he’s a fraud. Which do we believe?
Another thing that has me thinking was a conversation between Locke and Boone about Sayid. Boone wanted Sayid to stay away from Shannon. Locke tells him to let it go. Sayid is competent. We don’t want to make an enemy of him. We’re going to want him on our side.
I thought Flocke/Smokey couldn’t cross water. How did he get to the Hydra to ‘rescue’ everyone from the cages?
Claire is saved because Aron is the candidate.
Did anyone see the First Aid kit behind Lapidus right after Hurley couldn’t find it?
I cant believe they just did that to 3 characters in one ep. I dont even know how to feel right now!
I am so traumatized right now….thats all I can say SUN JEN SAYID LAPIDUS
They have to die for the timelines to mesh.
why do they have to die for the timelines to mesh?
[quote comment=”373872″]I thought Flocke/Smokey couldn’t cross water. How did he get to the Hydra to ‘rescue’ everyone from the cages?[/quote]
He took the outrigger.
I don’t know why…but I think its because of course correction. They started a new timeline and it has to be fixed.
[quote comment=”373879″][quote comment=”373872″]I thought Flocke/Smokey couldn’t cross water. How did he get to the Hydra to ‘rescue’ everyone from the cages?[/quote]
He took the outrigger.[/quote]
Thanks, LostFan. I was not watching constantly, so I missed that small detail!
Sayid saved Desmond YAY
Wow! Like, wow!! I was standing 5 feet in front of my telly, which was at a completely inappropriate volume, yelling at Jack, Sawyer, and the whole lot of them.
A few more eps like that, and they can end it however the he77 they want to; snow globe, Jeebus, good/evil, all a dream, or whatever.
Jeez Louise!!!
I am so sad about sayid he came back to the good side and then left us. so sad
Kind of like the nuke confrontation all over again. Except this time Sawyer didn’t listen to Jack.
Where are Ben and Miles?
No wonder Jin and Sun’s reunion was so unemotional. They set us up for this. We finally get proof that Sayid has turned back and BOOM. We knew people were going to die but I cried anyway. To quote Sawyer, SOB!
My DVR didn’t record the last few mins. of the show! Can someone please tell me what happened when they are on back on shore at the end?
Wasnt that a song from EVITA?
“Dont Cry For Me Jorgegarcia”
[quote comment=”373888″]My DVR didn’t record the last few mins. of the show! Can someone please tell me what happened when they are on back on shore at the end?[/quote]
Flocke could sense that they aren’t all dead so he tells Claire he’s going to finish what he started.
[quote comment=”373886″]Where are Ben and Miles?[/quote]
With Richard getting explosives to blow up the sub.
[quote comment=”373890″][quote comment=”373888″]My DVR didn’t record the last few mins. of the show! Can someone please tell me what happened when they are on back on shore at the end?[/quote]
Flocke could sense that they aren’t all dead so he tells Claire he’s going to finish what he started.[/quote]
Thank you!
I forgot to mention Lapidus. Sheesh, they kept him around pretty much not doing anything just to add to the body count. I too am wondering what happened to Richard, Ben and Miles. They went to blow up the plane.
[quote comment=”373891″][quote comment=”373886″]Where are Ben and Miles?[/quote]
With Richard getting explosives to blow up the sub.[/quote]
Oh wait, it was the plane.
Great job Sawyer.
[quote comment=”373894″][quote comment=”373891″][quote comment=”373886″]Where are Ben and Miles?[/quote]
With Richard getting explosives to blow up the sub.[/quote]
Oh wait, it was the plane.[/quote]
Many thanks.
So, I’m thinking Richard, Miles & Co. rigged the plane, not Widmore.
[quote comment=”373897″]So, I’m thinking Richard, Miles & Co. rigged the plane, not Widmore.[/quote]
But weren’t they using dynamite from Black Rock – not C4?
[quote comment=”373898″][quote comment=”373897″]So, I’m thinking Richard, Miles & Co. rigged the plane, not Widmore.[/quote]
But weren’t they using dynamite from Black Rock – not C4?[/quote]
Hmmm…good point.
Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?
[quote comment=”373899″][quote comment=”373898″][quote comment=”373897″]So, I’m thinking Richard, Miles & Co. rigged the plane, not Widmore.[/quote]
But weren’t they using dynamite from Black Rock – not C4?[/quote]
Hmmm…good point.[/quote]
After Hurley blew up Black Rock, they went to get Others explosives. It might have been C4.
[quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
Without Frank? Can he pilot the plane himself?
[quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
Good point! If all the candidates are dead, Flocke could leave on the plane, but now that Lapidus is dead, who would fly it?
Tweener Jacob is going to take over the island, now that the fLosties got fLucked by fLocke. Frank was not a certified deadie… but likely so.
Was not Sun pinned against an escape door?
Could they have not opened that door and swum to the surface?
Since when does it take a sub five minutes to surface from just a hundred feet?
Why was it so light after they were free from the polar bear cages in the dark of night?
Why does fLocke protect Claire with his body from rifle fire when bullets pass directly through his body?
Why is Widmore such a douche about using the skilz of the fLosties to fight fLocke?
What was Zoe up to when Chip/Seamus was getting his butt kicked by the Smoke Monster?
Why were the fLosties locked in the cages when they could have been secured better inside the Hydra station?
Who thought Locke’s fiancee Helen (Peg Bundy) was going to kiss Jack on the mouth when she hugged him for saving John in LA?
Who thinks that Claire should be a red stain on the walls of the sunken sub and not Sayid?
Will Miles eventually hear the words of those that died in the sub?
Will the Smoke Monster use the corpse of Widmore to hand-wash, hand-wax the exterior of the Ajira airplane to prepare it for flight?
Is Desmond Hume the last resort of the fLosties that made it to the beach?
Will Sawyer lose his ability to speak like Sun, only to regain it speaking only in “Redneck nicknames”?
[quote comment=”373903″][quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
Good point! If all the candidates are dead, Flocke could leave on the plane, but now that Lapidus is dead, who would fly it?[/quote]
Just spit balling here…but he didn’t need an explosives tech to build a bomb…go figure.
Another thought….maybe he doesn’t need a vessel to leave at all once all the candidates are dead and there is no one keeping him.
[quote comment=”373890″][quote comment=”373888″]My DVR didn’t record the last few mins. of the show! Can someone please tell me what happened when they are on back on shore at the end?[/quote]
Flocke could sense that they aren’t all dead so he tells Claire he’s going to finish what he started.[/quote]
I think Flocke knew they weren’t dead because whatever is supposed to happen when they die, didn’t happen.
Gosh, that was sooooo sad!! But Sayid, back to the good side. sniff. Can’t take it–Sun and Jin.
ach, the heartache.
How is this possibly going to be wrapped up? What do we have, 3 hours left? What, it’s going to be just Jack and Locke left standing? And then…?
Great to see Bernard, though! And didn’t he seem to KNOW something. ‘I hope you find what you’re looking for.’ And wow on the Coop–I guess not the spawn of evil he was in the original story line.
Anybody else kinda miss Jacob? And Ben–I need a Ben fix. Will we see more Charlie? Will Charlie & Claire meet? Will Aaron be born (again) before the end?
I thought this was a good ep, but very emotional. I feel drained.
[quote comment=”373874″]Did anyone see the First Aid kit behind Lapidus right after Hurley couldn’t find it?[/quote]
My 12 year old son noticed that and we all got a good laugh out of it.
[quote comment=”373904″]
Will Sawyer lose his ability to speak like Sun, only to regain it speaking only in “Redneck nicknames”?[/quote]
LOL!
[quote comment=”373897″]So, I’m thinking Richard, Miles & Co. rigged the plane, not Widmore.[/quote]
Wouldn’t they have already blown it up if they were the ones that rigged it? I thought all they wanted to do was destroy the plane not kill people. That makes me think it was Widmore.
I just am not okay with how this is being played out… I understand that these is the FS and that in that one our beloved losties are alive and kicking.
But I don’t care about them. They haven’t gone through what ours have- the experiences had and relationships built. I am not okay how Sayid, Sun and Jin just went out. Their storyline in OUR reality was short changed to the umpteenth degree this season and tonight just sealed the deal. It’s not that they killed them- it’s that the respect for their stories and our love of them went out the window in how their characters were abruptly disposed of. Each should have had a semi-centric episode showing some character development this season at least- not shoving them to the back burner and letting them burn out. I liked Lapidus and all- but that SJS had the same fate as him tonight is just stupid.
I hope that they don’t eff this thing up anymore- hope for redemption seems to be lost on me.
Yah, what’s Locke’s game, anyway? And how is it possible that a psycho-bit-o-smoke trapped on an island for centuries knows how to construct trick C4 bombs?
We’re leaping here, leaping the leap of faith!
But I still loved it.
wow, what an ep. Whatever happened, happened. Now there is only the chance they will all be alive back in sideways world and remember the island. Notice Jin walking though the hospital.
What a tragic fate for Sun and Jin, reunited and then almost immediately torn apart again.
Damn Island!
But still, we saw only their hands release. Was it Jin, still alive, who finally accepted that he had to “let go”?
Clearly I’m in denial, and unable to let go!
We only saw Frank washed back into the sub when the hatch door blew in (creepy Charlie deja-va feeling there), so there’s a slim possibility he made it out. Maybe?
I do think our Sayid went boom-splat,I’m sorry to say, his redemption complete.
Alot to absorb, including every Sideways Jack and Locke conversation, with nearly every word echoing out of the Island timeline. Man, my scalp was tingling when Locke was talking in his sleep, “Push the button…” !!
This is one I’m going to have to watch a few more times, but I thought it was brilliant.
[quote comment=”373904″]Tweener Jacob is going to take over the island, now that the fLosties got fLucked by fLocke. Frank was not a certified deadie… but likely so.
Will Sawyer lose his ability to speak like Sun, only to regain it speaking only in “Redneck nicknames”?[/quote]
LMAO…
At first I thought Jack was being naive but he seems very enlightened now sort of like Desmond.
So Flocke is protective of Claire. Hmmm He mentioned to Kate awhile back that Aaron now has a crazy mother just like he had. Funny that Locke had a schizophrenic mother too.
Did anyone else notice that FS Locke, whispering in his sleep “I wish you had believed me”, then Jack saying to FS Locke “I wish you would believe me” as FS Locke was wheeling himself down the hall, seemed to trigger something in FS Locke as he heard Jack say those words? As if he was remembering it…
I agree with many -emotional and disappointing. Sun and Jin went through all that for what? A 4 hour re-union and then this? Sayid comes back from the dark side and then we lose him? So sad!!
Maybe the only way to merge the two timelines is to have them all die in one of them.
What was all that about with John and Jack in FSW?
I think Jack is going to fix John eventually, and when the timelines merge they all wind up back on the island, and it turns out that JACK fixed John –not the island. John is sent back to fix things so they don’t end up like they do –like they are–with everyone dying.
[quote comment=”373897″]
So, I’m thinking Richard, Miles & Co. rigged the plane, not Widmore.
[/quote]
Good point… except how did they get Widmore’s security guys to guard the plane for them?
[quote comment=”373914″]What a tragic fate for Sun and Jin, reunited and then almost immediately torn apart again.
Damn Island!
But still, we saw only their hands release. Was it Jin, still alive, who finally accepted that he had to “let go”?
Clearly I’m in denial, and unable to let go!
We only saw Frank washed back into the sub when the hatch door blew in (creepy Charlie deja-va feeling there), so there’s a slim possibility he made it out. Maybe?
I do think our Sayid went boom-splat,I’m sorry to say, his redemption complete.
Alot to absorb, including every Sideways Jack and Locke conversation, with nearly every word echoing out of the Island timeline. Man, my scalp was tingling when Locke was talking in his sleep, “Push the button…”
!!
This is one I’m going to have to watch a few more times, but I thought it was brilliant.[/quote]
I feel strongly that Jin died with Sun. He promised he would never leave her again, and he didn’t.
Anyone else say “good, he deserved it” when they saw that douche anthony cooper?
I want smokey destroyed- i don’t want him alive and wallowing on the island- jacob needs to put out a hit on his a$$
[quote comment=”373918″]
What was all that about with John and Jack in FSW?
I think Jack is going to fix John eventually, and when the timelines merge they all wind up back on the island, and it turns out that JACK fixed John –not the island. John is sent back to fix things so they don’t end up like they do –like they are–with everyone dying.[/quote]
I like this.
: ) P
ok so flocke doesnt need them to leave. He needs them dead to leave. But cant kill them. Also I miss Ben. Also I want to see Jacob again he is so HOT!!! ok pefect ending for me would be everyone comes back to life and jack and kate end up together sawyer and juliet. charlie and claire. sayid and nadia. hugo and miss crazy pants. Ok and then they all live in a neighborhood together and are best of friends. Sit around drinking coffee talking about there crazy days on the island
[quote comment=”373911″] I am not okay how Sayid, Sun and Jin just went out. Their storyline in OUR reality was short changed to the umpteenth degree this season and tonight just sealed the deal. It’s not that they killed them- it’s that the respect for their stories and our love of them went out the window in how their characters were abruptly disposed of.
I liked Lapidus and all- but that SJS had the same fate as him tonight is just stupid.[/quote]
Actually, I had the opposite reaction. Hurley, Kate, and Jack actually got to mourn the loss of their friends. Normally, someone dies, the others are told about it, they all have solemn looks, and then they start trekking through the woods again. At least here was recognition that 3 of our friends, who we’ve grown to love over this series, are gone. We got the chance to say a proper goodbye. So sad, but satisfying.
As for Lapidus, I agree with you. Why the hell have they been dragging him along all this time?? We thought it was because eventually he’d fly them all out. I do believe he died on the sub. Kind of a whimper of an ending for him.
And oh yeah… where the hell are Richard and Ben?? Time to help save the freaking day, guys!!
[quote comment=”373920″]Anyone else say “good, he deserved it” when they saw that douche anthony cooper?[/quote]
That’s almost exactly what I said to my TV when I saw him sitting there like a vegetable. Locke’s story about the plane crash was sad, but I was still happy to see his father’s fate. (To the credit of that actor, I guess!)
So, if Sawyer hadn’t messed with the bomb, would it have gone off? Since Flocke can’t kill them, did Sawyer’s actions cause the bomb to detonate?
[quote comment=”373923″][quote comment=”373911″] I am not okay how Sayid, Sun and Jin just went out. Their storyline in OUR reality was short changed to the umpteenth degree this season and tonight just sealed the deal. It’s not that they killed them- it’s that the respect for their stories and our love of them went out the window in how their characters were abruptly disposed of.
I liked Lapidus and all- but that SJS had the same fate as him tonight is just stupid.[/quote]
Actually, I had the opposite reaction. Hurley, Kate, and Jack actually got to mourn the loss of their friends. Normally, someone dies, the others are told about it, they all have solemn looks, and then they start trekking through the woods again. At least here was recognition that 3 of our friends, who we’ve grown to love over this series, are gone. We got the chance to say a proper goodbye. So sad, but satisfying.
As for Lapidus, I agree with you. Why the hell have they been dragging him along all this time?? We thought it was because eventually he’d fly them all out. I do believe he died on the sub. Kind of a whimper of an ending for him.
And oh yeah… where the hell are Richard and Ben?? Time to help save the freaking day, guys!![/quote]
I think that my reaction came from some disappointment I have now with how Sun and Jin were played out this season. Keeping them apart for so long and the anit-climactic reunion (as someone pointed out, this was probably the case b/c they were about ready to kill them on us), now a death that screams “I’ll never let go, Jack. I’ll never let go”. Just kind of cliched and convenient… and Sun transformed herself into arguably the strongest and awesome-est female character to be on this show. ::sigh:: See ya in another life, sister. I agree that I was glad the beached losties got to mourn. Can’t wait to see Ben soon, to see Shannon and Juliette ( pretty sure that Shannon did film this season- correct me if I am wrong). And Aaron’s role… and Jack’s baby mama..
[quote comment=”373921″][quote comment=”373918″]
What was all that about with John and Jack in FSW?
I think Jack is going to fix John eventually, and when the timelines merge they all wind up back on the island, and it turns out that JACK fixed John –not the island. John is sent back to fix things so they don’t end up like they do –like they are–with everyone dying.[/quote]
I like this.
: ) P[/quote]
And maybe John is the candidate – not for the operation, but to be the one who goes back to the crash to see if he can fix what he has done.
Locke will come back to life and kill Flocke. Good wins versus evil. They re-unite off the island and remember everything that has happened and do good deeds for the rest of their lives
And when you see a detonator plugged into plastique explosives accelerate… who the heck runs with it – you grab all of the wires and yank them out immediately.
[quote comment=”373929″]And when you see a detonator plugged into plastique explosives accelerate… who the heck runs with it – you grab all of the wires and yank them out immediately.[/quote]
Not if you’re Sayid, the King of Pain…
[quote comment=”373925″]So, if Sawyer hadn’t messed with the bomb, would it have gone off? Since Flocke can’t kill them, did Sawyer’s actions cause the bomb to detonate?[/quote]
I agree that messing with the bomb caused it to detonate. I wonder why he chose to put it in Jack’s backpack. He’s the only one that didn’t want to go on.
[quote comment=”373929″]And when you see a detonator plugged into plastique explosives accelerate… who the heck runs with it – you grab all of the wires and yank them out immediately.[/quote]
Sounds like you’ve been there.
Clare symbolizes Abandonment. fLocke is Fear and fosters Abandonment. Alternately, Jacob is Hope and continually watches for Cooperation and Symbiosis.
[quote comment=”373933″]Clare symbolizes Abandonment. fLocke is Fear and fosters Abandonment. Alternately, Jacob is Hope and continually watches for Cooperation and Symbiosis.[/quote]
So if Love and Fear are the two fundamental emotions, would you go so far as to say that Jacob represents Love? Remember tied in with Love is Free Will.
[quote comment=”373934″][quote comment=”373933″]Clare symbolizes Abandonment. fLocke is Fear and fosters Abandonment. Alternately, Jacob is Hope and continually watches for Cooperation and Symbiosis.[/quote]
So if Love and Fear are the two fundamental emotions, would you go so far as to say that Jacob represents Love? Remember tied in with Love is Free Will.[/quote]
Good question – but I wonder if it’s Fear vs. Love or Fear vs. Hope. Maybe Hope is even more fundamental than Love. (So, then, Jacob could be Hope). As far as Free Will – fLocke cites it when he ‘recruits,’ so the writers seem to say that we can freely choose to live in either hope or fear. What do you think?
And along the lines of freely choosing Hope or Fear, I wonder if the “Game” between Jacob and MIB progresses/regresses as each group of island survivors chooses to cooperate or abandon each other (“Live together, die alone”)…
[quote comment=”373931″][quote comment=”373925″]So, if Sawyer hadn’t messed with the bomb, would it have gone off? Since Flocke can’t kill them, did Sawyer’s actions cause the bomb to detonate?[/quote]
I agree that messing with the bomb caused it to detonate. I wonder why he chose to put it in Jack’s backpack. He’s the only one that didn’t want to go on.[/quote]
[quote comment=”373931″][quote comment=”373925″]So, if Sawyer hadn’t messed with the bomb, would it have gone off? Since Flocke can’t kill them, did Sawyer’s actions cause the bomb to detonate?[/quote]
I agree that messing with the bomb caused it to detonate. I wonder why he chose to put it in Jack’s backpack. He’s the only one that didn’t want to go on.[/quote]
Sawyer should have trusted Jack this time. Flocke needs Jack dead too hence the bomb in the backpack.
[quote comment=”373924″][quote comment=”373920″]Anyone else say “good, he deserved it” when they saw that douche anthony cooper?[/quote]
That’s almost exactly what I said to my TV when I saw him sitting there like a vegetable. Locke’s story about the plane crash was sad, but I was still happy to see his father’s fate. (To the credit of that actor, I guess!)[/quote]
I concur. I said it was poetic justice.
[quote comment=”373932″]
Sounds like you’ve been there.
[/quote]
C-8, not C-4. C-4 is so 1990’s. (and yes).
I still have a heavy heart over the deaths tonight. I almost thought Sun would tell Jin that their child needed him. I wouldn’t have left either. It would torture you for the rest of your life.
***BREAKING NEWS***
LOST finale will be 2.5 hours! On Sunday, May 26th, it will start at 9pm and run until 11:30pm, pre-empting local news and followed immediately by the Jimmy Kimmel post LOST special episode!
***BREAKING NEWS***
: ) P
[quote comment=”373929″]And when you see a detonator plugged into plastique explosives accelerate… who the heck runs with it – you grab all of the wires and yank them out immediately.[/quote]
Good thinking. My first reaction was, it’s Widmore’s sub, I’m sure it had to have torpedo tubes.
[quote comment=”373942″][quote comment=”373929″]And when you see a detonator plugged into plastique explosives accelerate… who the heck runs with it – you grab all of the wires and yank them out immediately.[/quote]
Good thinking. My first reaction was, it’s Widmore’s sub, I’m sure it had to have torpedo tubes.[/quote]
My husband said the same thing about the torpedo tubes. (And like you, I also thought Sun would tell Jin to save himself and get Ji Yeung – that’s the only right way he could have abandoned Sun.)
Does anyone else think that Linus is to be reunited with Whitmore to work together, and eventually die together for the cause. That is why he has been out of the storyline as of late
Agree on the very heavy heart syndrome tonight… but, if they are indeed already dead… maybe a mass resurrection is in order “under the snowglobe”. Artz, Ana, Eko, etc… dare I say Nikki and Paolo… of course this would be after MiB/Smokey is rinsed from existence.
[quote comment=”373941″]***BREAKING NEWS***
LOST finale will be 2.5 hours! On Sunday, May 26th, it will start at 9pm and run until 11:30pm, pre-empting local news and followed immediately by the Jimmy Kimmel post LOST special episode!
***BREAKING NEWS***
: ) P[/quote]
That’s fantastic! I wonder how much show time we’ll get minus the commercials. PJSander, in your excitement you wrote the 26th instead of the 23rd.
[quote comment=”373946″]
That’s fantastic! I wonder how much show time we’ll get minus the commercials. PJSander, in your excitement you wrote the 26th instead of the 23rd.[/quote]
You are right, thank you. Yes, Sunday, May 23rd.
: ) P
WOW! OMFG! powerhouse episode!
Did Sayid say “Because it’s GOOD to be you, Jack” or “Because it’s GOING to be you, Jack” ?
I also thought that they could have put the C4 in the torpedo tubes, but the shock caused by the torpedo tube firing would detonate the explosive (just stomping on C4 hard enough will cause it to explode!)
forgot to add that the C4 has to be hot to detonate from shock so i guess the tubes would have worked, if they had enough time.
[quote comment=”373928″]Locke will come back to life and kill Flocke. Good wins versus evil. They re-unite off the island and remember everything that has happened and do good deeds for the rest of their lives[/quote]
hmmm, that’s interesting. i figured Jack would kill Flocke after figuring out who Locke is in alternate reality. (remember Sun freaking out when she saw Locke?). After tonight, I guessed Jack would kill the Locke in the alternate reality during surgery (after he convinces him to have it). But I think your theory is excellent. Locke kills Flocke!
I think the title is very telling. The candidate, singular, and we were pretty much told it was Jack, which many of us thought.
I am more and more certain we will see Jack and FLocke sitting on the beach and Flocke having that “do you have any idea how much I want to kill you” look.
I am intrigued to see what Hurley and Sawyer’s roles will be.
My final thought goes back to Adam and Eve. The show went out of the way to remind everyone of them. For Adam and Eve to be characters of any significance, there will have to be another event or incident, right? If that is the case, what is going to cause the island to go back in time again?
what a great episode what a great show.
so as we should have known everything fLocke says is a lie or an attempt at manipulation
sayid/michael connection? both seemed to die under similar circumstances and for redemption
liked the jack curing locke in FsW being the reason he can walk in the island. dont know how to fit that in, guess I’ll have to wait for finale
2 more episodes left…
cant we just get one more season or a spin-off (nikki and paolo’s excellent adventure)
[quote comment=”373952″]
I think the title is very telling. The candidate, singular, and we were pretty much told it was Jack, which many of us thought.
[/quote]
snotevenclose – jack tells locke he is a candidate in the opening scenes. jack was last episode – the last recruit. episode had fiance helen and father cooper as the guests actors. that means the episode called the candidate is locke centric.
[quote comment=”373952″]I think the title is very telling. The candidate, singular, and we were pretty much told it was Jack, which many of us thought.
I am more and more certain we will see Jack and FLocke sitting on the beach and Flocke having that “do you have any idea how much I want to kill you” look.
I am intrigued to see what Hurley and Sawyer’s roles will be.
My final thought goes back to Adam and Eve. The show went out of the way to remind everyone of them. For Adam and Eve to be characters of any significance, there will have to be another event or incident, right? If that is the case, what is going to cause the island to go back in time again?[/quote]
I thought of Adam and Eve too…with Sun and Jin dying. Which led me to wonder if we’re all just assuming the island losties are in 2007, but really they’re in the past. Now I realize Sun & Jin died in water, not a cave…but still food for thought. And as for Widmore, maybe Des brought him back in time too. Just an oddball thought.
Don’t Adam and Eve have those white and black stones in their pocket? So the implication is we will know who they are by knowing who has those stones.
I’ve thought for awhile that it must be Rose and Bernard, but I don’t see how that can be explained at all!!
When everyone was wondering who would fly the plane if Lapidus is dead…
When Locke was telling Jack about what happened to his father and how he became crippled (in the FSW), he said he had taken flying lessons and I immediately thought about him flying the plane off the island…a huge stretch, I know, but this is LOST. I don’t know if even I can buy into it, but why a “I took flying lessons…” story in the same episode as Lapidus dying? Just a thought.
Just had a thought – the music box that was left to Claire – is that the same box that Danielle had in her hideaway? If a different box, was it the same song?
[quote comment=”373955″][quote comment=”373952″]
I think the title is very telling. The candidate, singular, and we were pretty much told it was Jack, which many of us thought.
[/quote]
snotevenclose – jack tells locke he is a candidate in the opening scenes. jack was last episode – the last recruit. episode had fiance helen and father cooper as the guests actors. that means the episode called the candidate is locke centric.[/quote]
I would sooo love that! I know most people like Jack and from the beginning have seen him as the hero, but to me, it took him 5 1/2 seasons (how many island years?) to grow a pair, which to me just isn’t that heroic! I can’t wait to see how this all plays out.
P.S. Hope I am wrong about Jack, if so, I will admit it. I really am starting to like him a little bit. (Don’t tell my friends I said that)
[quote comment=”373959″]Just had a thought – the music box that was left to Claire – is that the same box that Danielle had in her hideaway? If a different box, was it the same song?[/quote]
From Lostpedia:
The song has appeared in four episodes of Lost, in connection with Claire and Aaron:
Claire requests that the Stewarts (Aaron’s prospective adoptive parents) sing “Catch a Falling Star” to the child after it is born, just as her father had done for her. (“Raised by Another”)
(It’s later revealed (“Par Avion”) that her father is Christian Shephard and that he sang to her as a baby, although this song is not specifically mentioned.)
The melody from “Catch a Falling Star” plays on the Oceanic airplane mobile hanging above the crib in the Staff nursery. (“Maternity Leave”)
Kate sings “Catch a Falling Star” to Aaron as she carries him from her car to Cassidy Phillips’ house. (“Whatever Happened, Happened”).
Claire sings “Catch a Falling Star” when she is in The Hole. (“Sundown”)
(The melody also plays as Sayid, Kate, and Claire walk through the Temple after it had been destroyed by the Man in Black)
[quote comment=”373961″][quote comment=”373959″]Just had a thought – the music box that was left to Claire – is that the same box that Danielle had in her hideaway? If a different box, was it the same song?[/quote]
From Lostpedia:
The song has appeared in four episodes of Lost, in connection with Claire and Aaron:
Claire requests that the Stewarts (Aaron’s prospective adoptive parents) sing “Catch a Falling Star” to the child after it is born, just as her father had done for her. (“Raised by Another”)
(It’s later revealed (“Par Avion”) that her father is Christian Shephard and that he sang to her as a baby, although this song is not specifically mentioned.)
The melody from “Catch a Falling Star” plays on the Oceanic airplane mobile hanging above the crib in the Staff nursery. (“Maternity Leave”)
Kate sings “Catch a Falling Star” to Aaron as she carries him from her car to Cassidy Phillips’ house. (“Whatever Happened, Happened”).
Claire sings “Catch a Falling Star” when she is in The Hole. (“Sundown”)
(The melody also plays as Sayid, Kate, and Claire walk through the Temple after it had been destroyed by the Man in Black)[/quote]
Which brings us back to Aaron. He was part of the story from the beginning…where is he now?
The big question Lost seems to ask again and again is how do you trust, how do you have faith in someone, when you don’t trust yourself.
[quote comment=”373948″]WOW! OMFG! powerhouse episode!
Did Sayid say “Because it’s GOOD to be you, Jack” or “Because it’s GOING to be you, Jack” ?[/quote]
The latter.
How would Sayid know, though? I’m thinking Desmond clued him in. Sayid took the time to tell Jack to rescue Desmond. As a reminder that Des is still really important to all of this.
[quote comment=”373958″]When everyone was wondering who would fly the plane if Lapidus is dead…
When Locke was telling Jack about what happened to his father and how he became crippled (in the FSW), he said he had taken flying lessons and I immediately thought about him flying the plane off the island…a huge stretch, I know, but this is LOST. I don’t know if even I can buy into it, but why a “I took flying lessons…” story in the same episode as Lapidus dying? Just a thought.[/quote]
I thought the same thing when Locke told that story. But then I thought… if MIB is the smoke monster or some kind of energy or spirit of some sort… would he really need a plane to get off of the island? I agree w/ an earlier post that fLocke knew that some were still alive because what was supposed to happen when they died… didnt happen. I think Lapidus was there to trick us all into thinking that they could all leave by plane at some point.
Also Locke noticed Jin in the hospital. Did he remember him from the flight 815 or was it one of those weird “I know you from another life” feelings that have become common lately?
MIB: “We can’t get on the plane. It’s a confined area, enclosed space that Widmore would have us trapped in. Instead, let’s GET IN THE SUBMARINE.” Losties: “Ok”. Me: (cringe).
[quote comment=”373962″][quote comment=”373961″][quote comment=”373959″]Just had a thought – the music box that was left to Claire – is that the same box that Danielle had in her hideaway? If a different box, was it the same song?[/quote]
From Lostpedia:
The song has appeared in four episodes of Lost, in connection with Claire and Aaron:
Claire requests that the Stewarts (Aaron’s prospective adoptive parents) sing “Catch a Falling Star” to the child after it is born, just as her father had done for her. (“Raised by Another”)
(It’s later revealed (“Par Avion”) that her father is Christian Shephard and that he sang to her as a baby, although this song is not specifically mentioned.)
The melody from “Catch a Falling Star” plays on the Oceanic airplane mobile hanging above the crib in the Staff nursery. (“Maternity Leave”)
Kate sings “Catch a Falling Star” to Aaron as she carries him from her car to Cassidy Phillips’ house. (“Whatever Happened, Happened”).
Claire sings “Catch a Falling Star” when she is in The Hole. (“Sundown”)
(The melody also plays as Sayid, Kate, and Claire walk through the Temple after it had been destroyed by the Man in Black)[/quote]
Which brings us back to Aaron. He was part of the story from the beginning…where is he now?[/quote]
I’ve been thinking about Aaron too. And here’s my theory:
The reason we don’t know MIB’s name is because somehow (don’t ask me how – time flashes and such) – he is Aaron. “Evil Incarnate” = “Evil Re-incarnate.” Anyway…here’s why I’m thinking this. Flocke has gone out of his way numerous times to save Claire, including last night. He doesn’t have to. She’s no longer a candidate. He appeared as Christian when she almost died in the explosion; and has basically helped her stay alive for three years in the jungle.
MIB also told Kate he has a crazy mother and now Aaron does too.
And…somehow…Jacob or the island must know this. Back to season 1 – the Others kidnapped Claire and was planning on killing her after taking the baby.
[quote comment=”373967″][quote comment=”373962″][quote comment=”373961″][quote comment=”373959″]Just had a thought – the music box that was left to Claire – is that the same box that Danielle had in her hideaway? If a different box, was it the same song?[/quote]
From Lostpedia:
The song has appeared in four episodes of Lost, in connection with Claire and Aaron:
Claire requests that the Stewarts (Aaron’s prospective adoptive parents) sing “Catch a Falling Star” to the child after it is born, just as her father had done for her. (“Raised by Another”)
(It’s later revealed (“Par Avion”) that her father is Christian Shephard and that he sang to her as a baby, although this song is not specifically mentioned.)
The melody from “Catch a Falling Star” plays on the Oceanic airplane mobile hanging above the crib in the Staff nursery. (“Maternity Leave”)
Kate sings “Catch a Falling Star” to Aaron as she carries him from her car to Cassidy Phillips’ house. (“Whatever Happened, Happened”).
Claire sings “Catch a Falling Star” when she is in The Hole. (“Sundown”)
(The melody also plays as Sayid, Kate, and Claire walk through the Temple after it had been destroyed by the Man in Black)[/quote]
Which brings us back to Aaron. He was part of the story from the beginning…where is he now?[/quote]
I’ve been thinking about Aaron too. And here’s my theory:
The reason we don’t know MIB’s name is because somehow (don’t ask me how – time flashes and such) – he is Aaron. “Evil Incarnate” = “Evil Re-incarnate.” Anyway…here’s why I’m thinking this. Flocke has gone out of his way numerous times to save Claire, including last night. He doesn’t have to. She’s no longer a candidate. He appeared as Christian when she almost died in the explosion; and has basically helped her stay alive for three years in the jungle.
MIB also told Kate he has a crazy mother and now Aaron does too.
And…somehow…Jacob or the island must know this. Back to season 1 – the Others kidnapped Claire and was planning on killing her after taking the baby.[/quote]
Totally agree.
[quote comment=”373966″]MIB: “We can’t get on the plane. It’s a confined area, enclosed space that Widmore would have us trapped in. Instead, let’s GET IN THE SUBMARINE.” Losties: “Ok”. Me: (cringe).[/quote]
Yup, as soon as that was said, I told the family, “He’s gonna kill them, he been lying about needing to leave with them.”
[quote comment=”373968″][quote comment=”373967″][quote comment=”373962″][quote comment=”373961″][quote comment=”373959″][/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
I’ve been thinking about Aaron too. And here’s my theory:
The reason we don’t know MIB’s name is because somehow (don’t ask me how – time flashes and such) – he is Aaron. “Evil Incarnate” = “Evil Re-incarnate.” Anyway…[/quote]
Totally agree.[/quote]
Maybe so, but I’m not ready to buy that MIB=Aaron yet though. That would make him two entities at one time as Aaron is alive now and MIB exists now.
I can buy Aaron is MIB’s candidate and as part of the rules, MIB has to have a replacement.
[quote comment=”373970″][quote comment=”373968″][quote comment=”373967″][quote comment=”373962″][quote comment=”373961″][quote comment=”373959″][/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
I’ve been thinking about Aaron too. And here’s my theory:
The reason we don’t know MIB’s name is because somehow (don’t ask me how – time flashes and such) – he is Aaron. “Evil Incarnate” = “Evil Re-incarnate.” Anyway…[/quote]
Totally agree.[/quote]
Maybe so, but I’m not ready to buy that MIB=Aaron yet though. That would make him two entities at one time as Aaron is alive now and MIB exists now.
I can buy Aaron is MIB’s candidate and as part of the rules, MIB has to have a replacement.[/quote]
There is clearly a reason why we have not yet learned MIB’s name. MIB said that he was a man once until Jacob did that to him. Since everything and everyone on LOST is related somehow… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
I think Jack asking Claire to come live w/ him was significant. Jack saying to Claire that they are family will possibly convince her to not give the baby up for adoption.
I really don’t know what to expect with the last episodes. But here are some of my differing ideas.
1. I almost 100% believe that MIB is evil and Jacob is good. But what if the twist is that MIB is good. What if MIB is really looking out for everyone and is killing everyone just to get them all back to their true life (the FSW). He knows that they won’t really be dead if his plan works, even if it takes 100’s of yrs. That’s why as Locke talking in his sleep he said I wish you would have trusted me.
2. Flocke will fly the plane off the island. Locke’s memories from FSW will sink up with Flocke’s and when he gets off the island it will be the last needed change to get back to FSW.
3. I don’t think Jack stays on the island because in the FSW he’s in LA. I don’t think anyone replaced Jacob, or at least stays on the island as a replacement.
4. Or if Flocke is really evil, Jack is the one who figures out exactly how to fix everything from Des’s visions.
5. If all Flocke had to do was kill the candidates, why didn’t he have them get on the plane? The bomb would have killed them. Unless they all need to die and then him leave the island? Or he needs one alive and leave with that person?
[quote comment=”373952″]I think the title is very telling. The candidate, singular, and we were pretty much told it was Jack, which many of us thought.
I am more and more certain we will see Jack and FLocke sitting on the beach and Flocke having that “do you have any idea how much I want to kill you” look.
I am intrigued to see what Hurley and Sawyer’s roles will be.
My final thought goes back to Adam and Eve. The show went out of the way to remind everyone of them. For Adam and Eve to be characters of any significance, there will have to be another event or incident, right? If that is the case, what is going to cause the island to go back in time again?[/quote]
Good thought but I think that there is significance when that conversation between Jacob and MIB happens and one of them says “it only ends once.” (I can’t remember which one said it). This leads me to believe that the end of this show is going to close that circle of events and either MIB will be destroyed OR MIB will be freed of the island and evil will penetrate the universe. I’m forecasting that the end will be a team effort to take down MIB and that when this happens everyone may possibly die in island time and the Sideways Time will be the only remaining time, but people in Sideways Time will have the memories of the island time and their island lives.
Big answer revealed: Absolutely fLocke needed them to kill themselves all along… finally confirmed. They worked it in there too without slapping our faces with it.
on Aaron: If Widmore didn’t bring Aaron to the island with him, then he’s still in Claires bellayyyy. The world they left behind is gone, and it is 2004 in the sideways. …Speaking of Widmore, where the hell did he go?
Anthony Cooper was very interesting, being in that state.. I do say its payback. We still know that he was an awful man regardless of his relationship with Locke… without some more back story though… what do we know? It would be nice to see that maybe A.C. was responsible for his fate in that plane crash, Wile. E Coyote style…
Main thing though: Army of the Dead, I’ve been anticipating it since season 4… I don’t think zombies but they all get a piece in one way or another… could be a few mediums: perhaps that Des acts as a medium between the two worlds, Hurley a medium to the ghosts, and Miles a medium to the buried… I dunno, I dunno… something like that though.
[quote comment=”373972″]I almost 100% believe that MIB is evil and Jacob is good. But what if the twist is that MIB is good. What if MIB is really looking out for everyone and is killing everyone just to get them all back to their true life (the FSW). [/quote]
I’m not sure how much more MIB can do to prove he’s evil, except to knock on the inside of the TV screen and say “Hey! I’m the evil one!”
The producers even SAID he was the evil one: “There will be very little debate at the end of this episode that [Fake Locke] is evil and bad and has to be stopped. The main narrative reason for him killing our main characters is to establish how much of a bad guy he is and to clearly identify him as the antagonist rolling into the end of the series.”
http://popwatch.ew.com/2010/05/04/lost-producers-actors-candidate/
Let’s put this particular question to rest. Sometimes it’s not irony… the man in white is good and the man in black is not.
[quote comment=”373971″][/quote]
… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
[/quote]
I don’t see how learning MIB’s name creates a new character.
[quote comment=”373972″]I really don’t know what to expect with the last episodes. But here are some of my differing ideas.
1. I almost 100% believe that MIB is evil and Jacob is good. But what if the twist is that MIB is good. What if MIB is really looking out for everyone and is killing everyone just to get them all back to their true life (the FSW). He knows that they won’t really be dead if his plan works, even if it takes 100’s of yrs. That’s why as Locke talking in his sleep he said I wish you would have trusted me.
2. Flocke will fly the plane off the island. Locke’s memories from FSW will sink up with Flocke’s and when he gets off the island it will be the last needed change to get back to FSW.
3. I don’t think Jack stays on the island because in the FSW he’s in LA. I don’t think anyone replaced Jacob, or at least stays on the island as a replacement.
4. Or if Flocke is really evil, Jack is the one who figures out exactly how to fix everything from Des’s visions.
5. If all Flocke had to do was kill the candidates, why didn’t he have them get on the plane? The bomb would have killed them. Unless they all need to die and then him leave the island? Or he needs one alive and leave with that person?[/quote]
#5 – He couldn’t kill them on the plane because Jack was not going to get on the plane w/ them. It wouldnt work unless everyone was on. Everything has to be done using their own free will. Jack couldnt be forced on the plane so I’m guessing that fLocke thought that it would be easier to trick him into getting on the sub. Speaking of such… when fLocke was on the plane and looked in the overhead compartment we could not see the bomb. We saw the wires but the image in the overhead was blurred out. We know that you cant believe anything MIB says so how do we know for sure the bomb was placed on the plane by Widemore? I doubt it. fLocke has been carrying around that backpack forever. What if the only thing he needed were the wires and a timer(watch). He grabbed the watch off of the dead guy before he went into the plane and so-called found the bomb. Widemore’s men were not there to protect the plane from fLocke because Widemore knows guns cant harm him. They were there to keep the candidates from getting on the plane.
[quote comment=”373937″][quote comment=”373931″][quote comment=”373925″]So, if Sawyer hadn’t messed with the bomb, would it have gone off? Since Flocke can’t kill them, did Sawyer’s actions cause the bomb to detonate?[/quote]
I agree that messing with the bomb caused it to detonate. I wonder why he chose to put it in Jack’s backpack. He’s the only one that didn’t want to go on.[/quote]
[quote comment=”373931″][quote comment=”373925″]So, if Sawyer hadn’t messed with the bomb, would it have gone off? Since Flocke can’t kill them, did Sawyer’s actions cause the bomb to detonate?[/quote]
I agree that messing with the bomb caused it to detonate. I wonder why he chose to put it in Jack’s backpack. He’s the only one that didn’t want to go on.[/quote]
Sawyer should have trusted Jack this time. Flocke needs Jack dead too hence the bomb in the backpack.[/quote]
*****************
We could have hoped he would, but I really didn’t think he was going to! He did with the bomb and Juliet died! I think NOW Sawyer might be “changed” and believe Jack, but we will have to see. That is how Sawyer is~he reacts!
I love the clarity Jack has though and the end with him grieving his friends was beautiful. I know he gets it; but I think he was baffled at the loss of life. When they reunite with Des he will have an explanation that will give us some insight!
[quote comment=”373977″]He couldn’t kill them on the plane because Jack was not going to get on the plane w/ them. [/quote]
Agreed. Which makes me wonder… who exactly were the people who started shooting at the Losties? The only reason Jack got in the sub was because Kate got shot and he needed to help her. I wonder if the shooters were MIB’s men in his plan to get Jack on the sub.
[quote comment=”373976″][quote comment=”373971″][/quote]
… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
[/quote]
I don’t see how learning MIB’s name creates a new character.[/quote]
What I’m suggesting is that if MIB’s name was so insignificant than we would know it already. There is a reason we dont. If they kept his name a secret for all this time and his name ended up being Tom or some random name… that wouldnt make sense and does not fit the show. I think his name will be significant and is a name that we’ve already heard before.
[quote comment=”373980″][quote comment=”373976″][quote comment=”373971″][/quote]
… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
[/quote]
I don’t see how learning MIB’s name creates a new character.[/quote]
What I’m suggesting is that if MIB’s name was so insignificant than we would know it already. There is a reason we dont. If they kept his name a secret for all this time and his name ended up being Tom or some random name… that wouldnt make sense and does not fit the show. I think his name will be significant and is a name that we’ve already heard before.[/quote]
What you are suggesting is clear. But, I don’t see how he can be someone who is in the same time line as him…don’t make sense even for LOST.
[quote comment=”373981″][quote comment=”373980″][quote comment=”373976″][quote comment=”373971″][/quote]
… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
[/quote]
I don’t see how learning MIB’s name creates a new character.[/quote]
What I’m suggesting is that if MIB’s name was so insignificant than we would know it already. There is a reason we dont. If they kept his name a secret for all this time and his name ended up being Tom or some random name… that wouldnt make sense and does not fit the show. I think his name will be significant and is a name that we’ve already heard before.[/quote]
What you are suggesting is clear. But, I don’t see how he can be someone who is in the same time line as him…don’t make sense even for LOST.[/quote]
I see your point but this is assuming that we actually know whats going on w/ all of the timelines. Until May 23rd… we’re all as the name says… just guessing.
[quote comment=”373981″][quote comment=”373980″][quote comment=”373976″][quote comment=”373971″][/quote]
… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
[/quote]
I don’t see how learning MIB’s name creates a new character.[/quote]
What I’m suggesting is that if MIB’s name was so insignificant than we would know it already. There is a reason we dont. If they kept his name a secret for all this time and his name ended up being Tom or some random name… that wouldnt make sense and does not fit the show. I think his name will be significant and is a name that we’ve already heard before.[/quote]
What you are suggesting is clear. But, I don’t see how he can be someone who is in the same time line as him…don’t make sense even for LOST.[/quote]
Why is it so hard to reconcile justguessing’s suggestion? How would MIB = Aaron be any different then when the losties were jumping through time and existed on the island in two places at once. I’d say that’s pretty much the same thing, so I don’t think it’s out of bounds for this show.
No spoilers, just a link to a story about ABC’s schedule for the finale. They added 30 minutes and Jimmy Kimmel is going to do some stuff on his show.
http://www.examiner.com/x-11363-TV-Examiner~y2010m5d5-ABCs-Lost-getting-another-30-minutes-for-its-finale
saw someone ask, but saw no answer: What did Sayid say to Jack before he exploded? I was trying to listen but some people couldn’t stop yapping! Something about “because its going to be you…”
[quote comment=”373985″]saw someone ask, but saw no answer: What did Sayid say to Jack before he exploded? I was trying to listen but some people couldn’t stop yapping! Something about “because its going to be you…”[/quote]
He was telling Jack to go get Desmond out of the well (indicating he didn’t kill him. Sayid turned it around). He told Jack it had to be him (as in – no one else can get Des).
[quote comment=”373983″][quote comment=”373981″][quote comment=”373980″][quote comment=”373976″][quote comment=”373971″][/quote]
… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
[/quote]
I don’t see how learning MIB’s name creates a new character.[/quote]
What I’m suggesting is that if MIB’s name was so insignificant than we would know it already. There is a reason we dont. If they kept his name a secret for all this time and his name ended up being Tom or some random name… that wouldnt make sense and does not fit the show. I think his name will be significant and is a name that we’ve already heard before.[/quote]
What you are suggesting is clear. But, I don’t see how he can be someone who is in the same time line as him…don’t make sense even for LOST.[/quote]
Why is it so hard to reconcile justguessing’s suggestion? How would MIB = Aaron be any different then when the losties were jumping through time and existed on the island in two places at once. I’d say that’s pretty much the same thing, so I don’t think it’s out of bounds for this show.[/quote]
Nothing is out of bounds for this show – and we can’t assume we’re in 2007 on the island.
Agreed – if MIB’s name was “Bill” we’d already know it by now.
1. Do we know that Lapidus is dead?
2. Kind of mad at Sun for not teeling Jin to get out of there for their daughter’s sake.
3. I don’t think in the end there will be “replacements” for Jacob and MIB. I think the “game” will end (with MIB dead?) and the island will SINK!
[quote comment=”373985″]saw someone ask, but saw no answer: What did Sayid say to Jack before he exploded? I was trying to listen but some people couldn’t stop yapping! Something about “because its going to be you…”[/quote]
“Because it’s going to be you, Jack.” (Perhaps as in, Jack’s the candidate?)
When Locke was in the hospital talking in his sleep, saying that they needed to push the button, and that he wishes “you” would have believed me…. I thought it went back to previous seasons when the hatch blew up after the button wasn’t pushed (which started all the ff, fsw, fb…), and Jack not believing him and leaving th eisland the first time around. BUT, it was LOCKE speaking, very different from FLOCKE speaking.
[quote comment=”373986″][quote comment=”373985″]saw someone ask, but saw no answer: What did Sayid say to Jack before he exploded? I was trying to listen but some people couldn’t stop yapping! Something about “because its going to be you…”[/quote]
He was telling Jack to go get Desmond out of the well (indicating he didn’t kill him. Sayid turned it around). He told Jack it had to be him (as in – no one else can get Des).[/quote]
Niiice,,, yeah totally missed that. As far as Sayid dying I figured that this was sort of like a “Charlie” sacrifice… dont quite understand it entirely yet due to MIB saving him, but it seems that Sayids death was basically moved back to be for the good of the group…ala Charlie (he SHOULD have already died). I’d put a nickel on both Jin and Lapidus still being alive.
[quote comment=”373990″]When Locke was in the hospital talking in his sleep, saying that they needed to push the button, and that he wishes “you” would have believed me…. I thought it went back to previous seasons when the hatch blew up after the button wasn’t pushed (which started all the ff, fsw, fb…), and Jack not believing him and leaving th eisland the first time around. BUT, it was LOCKE speaking, very different from FLOCKE speaking.[/quote]
I wish you had believed me was the suicide note Locke left for Jack.
Locke mumbling in his sleep referred to the button being pushed (he was arguing with Jack about it) and the words in the note, though years later.
[quote comment=”373991″][quote comment=”373986″][quote comment=”373985″]saw someone ask, but saw no answer: What did Sayid say to Jack before he exploded? I was trying to listen but some people couldn’t stop yapping! Something about “because its going to be you…”[/quote]
He was telling Jack to go get Desmond out of the well (indicating he didn’t kill him. Sayid turned it around). He told Jack it had to be him (as in – no one else can get Des).[/quote]
Niiice,,, yeah totally missed that. As far as Sayid dying I figured that this was sort of like a “Charlie” sacrifice… dont quite understand it entirely yet due to MIB saving him, but it seems that Sayids death was basically moved back to be for the good of the group…ala Charlie (he SHOULD have already died).
I’d put a nickel on both Jin and Lapidus still being alive.[/quote]
Lapidus, maybe.
Jin, sorry to say, dead. The fake out of making us think Jin is dead, but he really is alive has already been done.
[quote comment=”373979″]
Agreed. Which makes me wonder… who exactly were the people who started shooting at the Losties? The only reason Jack got in the sub was because Kate got shot and he needed to help her. I wonder if the shooters were MIB’s men in his plan to get Jack on the sub.[/quote]
It could raise the idea that MIB and Widmore are in it together. Other than Tina Fey, Widmore’s team is gone, leaving no witnesses. The plane AND the sub were conveniently not guarded by the sonar fence. It’s like Widmore left the bomb exactly where he told MIB he would leave it. If this was one big con just by MIB, he would have left open too many variables by doing things like sending Sawyer to Hydra. But if he knew what Widmore was going to do when he captured Sawyer, that’s alltogether different. Bringing (kidnapping) Des along in the sub and letting him get captured just gets rid of one of Widmore’s problems too. The only things that the two didn’t count on are Faraday’s variables… like Sayid not killing Desmond. Just some thoughts.
[quote comment=”373983″][quote comment=”373981″][quote comment=”373980″][quote comment=”373976″][quote comment=”373971″][/quote]
… I’m thinking he has to be someone we already know. At this point I dont think there will be any new characters other than the ones enforcing the rules of the game.
[/quote]
I don’t see how learning MIB’s name creates a new character.[/quote]
What I’m suggesting is that if MIB’s name was so insignificant than we would know it already. There is a reason we dont. If they kept his name a secret for all this time and his name ended up being Tom or some random name… that wouldnt make sense and does not fit the show. I think his name will be significant and is a name that we’ve already heard before.[/quote]
What you are suggesting is clear. But, I don’t see how he can be someone who is in the same time line as him…don’t make sense even for LOST.[/quote]
Why is it so hard to reconcile justguessing’s suggestion? How would MIB = Aaron be any different then when the losties were jumping through time and existed on the island in two places at once. I’d say that’s pretty much the same thing, so I don’t think it’s out of bounds for this show.[/quote]
Because before there was any “time jumping” Aaron and Smokey were on the island at the same time.
I’ll out on a limb and predict that the reason we don’t know MIB’s name yet is not because he is Aaron but because he is Diablo.
Sun & Jin, sadly, are dead.
Lapidus, however, may not be. But I do recognize that he was likely kept around (like Kate) to be used as leverage, or to support a false agenda of leaving the island.
I do think Flocke wants/ needs them all dead. He had planned on Jack walking away with the C4 in his bag and being eliminated Alana/Artz style. Likely, For the same reason the Tempest was built, Flocke needs to purge the island to accomplish his goal. Chances are, MIB had some influence With each attempted Mass Murder on the Island.
And here’s something I think should’ve already been said, but to my knowledge hasn’t. I think Sayid HAS BEEN JACOB THE WHOLE TIME.
This was easily supposed when Sayid was protected, early in Season 6. It was important that he die at precisely the right moment, and be re-born from the temple pool, tested and confirmed as infected. Dogen however did not take into account (nor did anyone) that Sayid could be faking the whole time, or atleast be coming to terms slowly with his role… or possession. And wouldn’t it make sense for Jacob to want to keep a close eye on Flocke, so that he could, in such circumstance, make a clutch interception to save Jack? (who I believe will be mortally wounded and reborn as Jacob, or “the MIW”
When Sayid told Jack of Desmond, and that it was going to be him (Jack,) I feel that it this was in support of this theory. He saw that Jack understood the game/Island and he then knew Jack was ready. Could we see a “lightey” as described by Season 1 Locke? sure we haven’t seen it yet…
And who’s to say either of them are good or evil? Maybe they are simply equally opposing forces, both with the intention to overpower the other. Niether of them can die, they just waffle across the fence, or scales… They can never be totally equal (as in the Yin Yang of Toaism) because it is inequality that motivates progress, which is admittedly Jacob’s focus, while MIB’s may simply be anarchy/freedom.
Who knows. I also think Time travel plays a pretty big part in all this, but I’ll spare you.
Thanks!
[quote comment=”373996″]I’ll out on a limb and predict that the reason we don’t know MIB’s name yet is not because he is Aaron but because he is Diablo.[/quote]
does it really matter? what is the show has gone out its way to show/tell us MIB is “evil incarnate.” The only reason we are arguing MIB is aaron or even human at all is because the MIB told us he was once human. At what point do we realize that nothing the MIB says can be trusted. He is most likely NOT human but an entity that feeds on fear and despair.
my thought is the MIB only inhabits human vessels ala Locke so if he “is aaron” its not really aaron but simply a possession of the person. in other words MIB was never human…
I dont want to say that Widmores with MIB, but there is the fact that he so convienently dissapeared throughout the episode as well… where was he? He was there at the beggining, but then no where when the shit went down. Widmore seemed like he didn’t know who MIB was before,,, could that have just been a front for his people?
I want to say that Widmore has no idea what MIB is all about, but may have some notion about what is going to happen based on his years of being the leader of the Others and having gathered information. Seems like the Others had anticipated the 815’rs all along, so somewhere there must be some sort of writ of their actions…
MIB has a strong clairvoyance of what happens next, and knows peoples moves in advance because he’s seen it play out already. These could in one way or another go hand in hand.
[quote comment=”373998″][quote comment=”373996″]I’ll out on a limb and predict that the reason we don’t know MIB’s name yet is not because he is Aaron but because he is Diablo.[/quote]
does it really matter? [/quote]
Yes, to me it does matter WHO he is and IF he’s Aaron, because MIB has been a part of this show since the first episode (as Christian and in Smoke form). He’s not a new character since the season five finale, we are just learning more about him.
Right now I am holding on to Aaron being Jacob’s replacement or something big like that…maybe even MIB’s replacement. But not MIB=Aaron.
[quote comment=”373992″][quote comment=”373990″]When Locke was in the hospital talking in his sleep, saying that they needed to push the button, and that he wishes “you” would have believed me…. I thought it went back to previous seasons when the hatch blew up after the button wasn’t pushed (which started all the ff, fsw, fb…), and Jack not believing him and leaving th eisland the first time around. BUT, it was LOCKE speaking, very different from FLOCKE speaking.[/quote]
I wish you had believed me was the suicide note Locke left for Jack.
Locke mumbling in his sleep referred to the button being pushed (he was arguing with Jack about it) and the words in the note, though years later.[/quote]
**************
I think it shows that he too was remembering!
Two things not discussed yet, but that I found interesting!
1. Jack in FSW is starting to think it is more than a coincidence that so many of them were on the flight from Sydney…he is close to having his ah ha moment in FSW…
2. Thought it was interesting that He and Claire saw their reflections together in the mirror of the jewelry box and that it was the one thing her dad gave her…I think the song is what Christian sang to her as a child!
Anyone remember how we talked about their family being important…and even when Jack visited with his grandpa it seemed his grandfather knew something? This family is important and Aaron will be important too! just not sure how…
[quote comment=”373999″]I dont want to say that Widmores with MIB, but there is the fact that he so convienently dissapeared throughout the episode as well… where was he? He was there at the beggining, but then no where when the shit went down.
Widmore seemed like he didn’t know who MIB was before,,, could that have just been a front for his people?
I want to say that Widmore has no idea what MIB is all about, but may have some notion about what is going to happen based on his years of being the leader of the Others and having gathered information. Seems like the Others had anticipated the 815’rs all along, so somewhere there must be some sort of writ of their actions…
MIB has a strong clairvoyance of what happens next, and knows peoples moves in advance because he’s seen it play out already. These could in one way or another go hand in hand.[/quote]
MIB’s knowingness is by far the most important ingredient here. Understanding this, as well as the fact that there have been a zillion other candidates that played this same scenario for hundreds of years, leads one to believe that this might be the closest MIB has come to “winning”. I still do think there will be a change in perspective of which side is truly good an which is truly evil.
And yes, MIB HAS to have a CRAZY NAME!!! its so obvious… or Jacob would just be MIW for the past 6 seasons… UNLESS “Jacob” is some strange nickname that MIW used to play off of his real name, one that would have revealed so much to the islanders that it would have been like cheating in the game. So he uses Jacob.
…yeah i’m reaching…but HEY! IT’s REACHING TIME!
Another thought. Claire told Jack that she had never met their father, but in the original time line she met him after her mom’s accident, right?
Hmmm, when Flocke tells Jack that he should trust him because he could have killed Jack at anytime but instead SAVED him and his friends, it throws a wrench into the “candidates must die” theory. Flocke did save Jack from the bomb attack…
which leads me to think that it’s even more simple than we think. It’s just straight good vs evil. jacob told MIB that he brought these people to the island to show they can do good and redeem themselves. jacob wins if they complete that task. Kate’s name was crossed off the list of names because she’s already redeemed herself. So did Sayid. so i’m thinking that MIB wants the remaining candidates dead so MIB can win the bet vs jacob and leave the island.
the alternate reality that we see is a reminder of the good the remaining candidates can do, if they can redeem themselves on the island.
I think if we get to KNOW what Jacob and MIB’s core argument is, then a lot of things will be a lot clearer. [quote comment=”374003″]Two things not discussed yet, but that I found interesting!
2. Thought it was interesting that He and Claire saw their reflections together in the mirror of the jewelry box and that it was the one thing her dad gave her…I think the song is what Christian sang to her as a child!
Anyone remember how we talked about their family being important…and even when Jack visited with his grandpa it seemed his grandfather knew something? This family is important and Aaron will be important too! just not sure how…[/quote]
Hmm, and then David, too?
[quote comment=”374006″]Hmmm, when Flocke tells Jack that he should trust him because he could have killed Jack at anytime but instead SAVED him and his friends, it throws a wrench into the “candidates must die” theory. Flocke did save Jack from the bomb attack…
[/quote]
I disagree, Flocke saved Jack because he needs them to do the killing…he can’t kill candidates. When Jack said he wasn’t going with the rest, Flocke said he hoped Jack will change his mind. He wanted them to all die together because if they don’t, one will be left and since Flocke can’t kill a candidate, how would the last one die? The candidates must die…not leave together. MIB needs the last remaining Jacob candidates gone so there will be no replacement for Jacob. THAT is the second part of the loophole.
[quote comment=”373866″]LOST for Dummies – by Tarzan
Tarzan make much worry for current conflict on Tarzan island.
Tarzan more worry now than ever in time – as Temple friends gone.
Tarzan most worry that Tarzan no place run, no place hide, and everyone carry firesticks that kill.
Tarzan make easy hiding from Hydra Island peoples that crawl from shiny metal fish.
Tarzan not hide easy when Hydra peoples use night binoculars and throw exploding coconuts from small island.
Tarzan want to make attack stop, but no can find canoe anymore in bad neighborhood.
Tarzan see old friend Science Sheriff Sawyer hurry through jungle with tribe mates.
Tarzan not sure why they let crazy yellow-hair girl with squirrel nest on head get on big white canoe with them.
Tarzan hear they say they go to Hydra Island, so slip into water and hold rope on nose of giant canoe.
Tarzan happy to sneak over to small island without group knowing, but sad when Doctor name Jack swim back.
Shark with science tattoo swim to Doctor name Jack, sniff and swim away – not normally eat hairiest of primates.
Tarzan barely remember what next… hear words “drop anchor”… then hit on head and drag to bottom of sea.
When Tarzan gain brain sense and use of eyeballs, Tarzan see Sawyer tribe kneel on beach without firesticks.
Tarzan stay quiet in water and hide behind giant white canoe.
Then Tarzan heart almost stop make blood when see evil island overlord has returned.
Tarzan know face of Chuck Widmore at any age… it only face that ever give Tarzan sleeping night dreams that scare Tarzan.
Tarzan now certain. No place run – no place hide – grand island battle soon begin.
Tarzan now consider defecting to tropical island name Canada, or sleep in Rose and Bernard guest room.[/quote]
Hurray!!! Tarzan is back!! Missed you dude, was hoping you didnt get hit w/ any of those exploding coconuts.
[quote comment=”374006″]Hmmm, when Flocke tells Jack that he should trust him because he could have killed Jack at anytime but instead SAVED him and his friends, it throws a wrench into the “candidates must die” theory. Flocke did save Jack from the bomb attack…
which leads me to think that it’s even more simple than we think. It’s just straight good vs evil. jacob told MIB that he brought these people to the island to show they can do good and redeem themselves. jacob wins if they complete that task. Kate’s name was crossed off the list of names because she’s already redeemed herself. So did Sayid. so i’m thinking that MIB wants the remaining candidates dead so MIB can win the bet vs jacob and leave the island.
the alternate reality that we see is a reminder of the good the remaining candidates can do, if they can redeem themselves on the island.[/quote]
good one!
[quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
I took it that he wanted to make sure Jack was with them so he needed to build trust by exposing the hidden C4.
Anyway, I beleive for MIB to leave the island it won’t be by conventional means (ie boat, sub, plane, scooter etc..,) but by something more spiritual. When he was on the dock, he knew not all candidates were dead as he was still on the island. It appeared he had closed his eyes in anticipation of his “departure”.
I disagree, Flocke saved Jack because he needs them to do the killing…he can’t kill candidates. When Jack said he wasn’t going with the rest, Flocke said he hoped Jack will change his mind. He wanted them to all die together because if they don’t, one will be left and since Flocke can’t kill a candidate, how would the last one die? The candidates must die…not leave together. MIB needs the last remaining Jacob candidates gone so there will be no replacement for Jacob. THAT is the second part of the loophole.[/quote]
there are still plenty of other people on the island to kill someone if they are left behind…its not like MIB is pressed for time
my question is going back to the plane…why didnt flocke just let them get on…somehow get kate shot so jack goes on…and boom..end of story…why the switch…
and why the discussion of who Flocke is…hes “evil incarnate”…i guess an ancient name would be nice but i doubt its on of our charactoers…but who knows..not impossible
ANOTHER BIG QUESTION:
MIB fears nothing….EXCEPT for the KIW’s {Kids In Woods} …
…Who are they?
What role do they/will they play? ( I think they are MIW and MIB….I think that MIW and MIB are brothers…possibly twins… the spirits of unborn twins…one is not born, the other is born…MIB hates MIW for being born and wants to exterminate the will so that he may be born to reak havoc on earth.)
…can they beat Chuck Norris?
[quote comment=”373911″]I just am not okay with how this is being played out… I understand that these is the FS and that in that one our beloved losties are alive and kicking.
But I don’t care about them. They haven’t gone through what ours have- the experiences had and relationships built. I am not okay how Sayid, Sun and Jin just went out. Their storyline in OUR reality was short changed to the umpteenth degree this season and tonight just sealed the deal. It’s not that they killed them- it’s that the respect for their stories and our love of them went out the window in how their characters were abruptly disposed of. Each should have had a semi-centric episode showing some character development this season at least- not shoving them to the back burner and letting them burn out. I liked Lapidus and all- but that SJS had the same fate as him tonight is just stupid.
I hope that they don’t eff this thing up anymore- hope for redemption seems to be lost on me.[/quote]
You must really get depressed when people die in the real world. To me, I like it when the unexpected or hoped for doesn’t always happen, just like real life.
[quote comment=”374012″]
there are still plenty of other people on the island to kill someone if they are left behind…its not like MIB is pressed for time
[/quote]
Well no, he’s not pressed for time. But his plan was great on paper…get them all together with a bomb and see if THEY eliminate themselves all at once….mission accomplished. He didn’t account for Sayid switching sides again. Plan B is using the “plenty of other people on the island to kill…”.
[quote comment=”373996″]I’ll out on a limb and predict that the reason we don’t know MIB’s name yet is not because he is Aaron but because he is Diablo.[/quote]
I wondered about that, too. If we continue with some of the Christian symbolism.
I kinda hope we are going to get some kind of mystical/god-ish connection in this. I mean both MIB & Jacob have powers–but Jacob dies, so he can’t be more than an uber-human or a demi-god. But MIB–if we go back to pre-Christian, Egyptian or other pantheons, there were tons of gods, and many of them had very terrible mothers. So containment of a bad god might be the best that we poor humans can hope for.
And then maybe the Island under water is MIB winning his freedom?
Only FSW doesn’t seem like a bad deal. So where’s the havoc promised should MIB be freed?
Also, FSW still has it’s mix of good & evil, and our peops are free to choose between the 2. In the mix of black & white & gray that make them all human.
I loved Jacob’s tapestry metaphor–that working on that is what taught him patience. Remember when he meets Richard and flat out whales on him? Not the patient, calm, compassionate man (or being) that he seemed to be by the time Ben kills him.
And I thought maybe MIB had a lesson to learn, too. Jacob does call him an old friend, so maybe redemption might happen for him, too? I mean, the Smokey Temper, legendary! Destroy things first, worry about what it all means later.
It’s always all about HIM, isn’t it?
And who is that kid who keeps showing up? Smokey-as-a-youngster? Jacob as a youngster? Some other Immortal, waiting for The Lesson to be learned?
There’s still a lot of questions!!! I hope the answers–as many of them as we actually get–will be satisfying after all these years.
Flocke doesn’t let them get on the plane to blow up because there was no C4 in the plane. if you notice, Flocke picks up the dead guys watch BEFORE he boards the plane or finds the C4. he wouldn’t have needed it unless he was carrying the C4 himself.
I agree that Flocke can’t kill the candidates directly, but he could’ve let Jack die. 1 less candidate to worry about. i’m sure he could’ve tricked sawyer or someone else to do the killing
[quote comment=”373931″][quote comment=”373925″]So, if Sawyer hadn’t messed with the bomb, would it have gone off? Since Flocke can’t kill them, did Sawyer’s actions cause the bomb to detonate?[/quote]
I agree that messing with the bomb caused it to detonate. I wonder why he chose to put it in Jack’s backpack. He’s the only one that didn’t want to go on.[/quote]
fLocke and Jack were the only ones left behind as the others infiltrated the sub. Jack’s backpack was there, so….
[quote comment=”374011″][quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
I took it that he wanted to make sure Jack was with them so he needed to build trust by exposing the hidden C4.
Anyway, I beleive for MIB to leave the island it won’t be by conventional means (ie boat, sub, plane, scooter etc..,) but by something more spiritual. When he was on the dock, he knew not all candidates were dead as he was still on the island. It appeared he had closed his eyes in anticipation of his “departure”.[/quote]
Agreed, plenty of discussion since this post. 🙂
Have I missed how MIB can be killed? Does it have to do with that room Des was in or now that Des was exposed can he stand up and beat MIB?
I’m wondering if Des changed Sayid can he change MIB?
I have to disagree that unlock is the bad guy. I believe it is Jacob. If the MIB can be a smoke monster, why can’t Jacob also be a smoke monster, and the actual one who has done most of the killings? We just assume it was the MIB who killed the sailors on Richards ship. Why couldn’t it have been Jacob? Because he says he is the good one? Remember, it is Jacobs that has brought people to island over the centuries to ultimately die, not the MIB.
Yes, Jin and Sun died on the island, but they didn’t die in the flash-sideways. Jin walks past Jack and Flocke into Sun’s hospital room at the end of the show. I believe they all have to die on the island for all of them to have their true (better) sideways life–the life they would have had if Jacob had not interfered in their lives. Unlock is not trying to leave the island, that has just been part of his story to get the candidates to follow his plan and free them from the evils of Jacob.
Thoughts?
[quote comment=”373967″][quote comment=”373962″][quote comment=”373961″][quote comment=”373959″]Just had a thought – the music box that was left to Claire – is that the same box that Danielle had in her hideaway? If a different box, was it the same song?[/quote]
From Lostpedia:
The song has appeared in four episodes of Lost, in connection with Claire and Aaron:
Claire requests that the Stewarts (Aaron’s prospective adoptive parents) sing “Catch a Falling Star” to the child after it is born, just as her father had done for her. (“Raised by Another”)
(It’s later revealed (“Par Avion”) that her father is Christian Shephard and that he sang to her as a baby, although this song is not specifically mentioned.)
The melody from “Catch a Falling Star” plays on the Oceanic airplane mobile hanging above the crib in the Staff nursery. (“Maternity Leave”)
Kate sings “Catch a Falling Star” to Aaron as she carries him from her car to Cassidy Phillips’ house. (“Whatever Happened, Happened”).
Claire sings “Catch a Falling Star” when she is in The Hole. (“Sundown”)
(The melody also plays as Sayid, Kate, and Claire walk through the Temple after it had been destroyed by the Man in Black)[/quote]
Which brings us back to Aaron. He was part of the story from the beginning…where is he now?[/quote]
I’ve been thinking about Aaron too. And here’s my theory:
The reason we don’t know MIB’s name is because somehow (don’t ask me how – time flashes and such) – he is Aaron. “Evil Incarnate” = “Evil Re-incarnate.” Anyway…here’s why I’m thinking this. Flocke has gone out of his way numerous times to save Claire, including last night. He doesn’t have to. She’s no longer a candidate. He appeared as Christian when she almost died in the explosion; and has basically helped her stay alive for three years in the jungle.
MIB also told Kate he has a crazy mother and now Aaron does too.
And…somehow…Jacob or the island must know this. Back to season 1 – the Others kidnapped Claire and was planning on killing her after taking the baby.[/quote]
Brilliant, I like this.
[quote comment=”374021″]I have to disagree that unlock is the bad guy. I believe it is Jacob. If the MIB can be a smoke monster, why can’t Jacob also be a smoke monster, and the actual one who has done most of the killings? We just assume it was the MIB who killed the sailors on Richards ship. Why couldn’t it have been Jacob? Because he says he is the good one? Remember, it is Jacobs that has brought people to island over the centuries to ultimately die, not the MIB.
Yes, Jin and Sun died on the island, but they didn’t die in the flash-sideways. Jin walks past Jack and Flocke into Sun’s hospital room at the end of the show. I believe they all have to die on the island for all of them to have their true (better) sideways life–the life they would have had if Jacob had not interfered in their lives. Unlock is not trying to leave the island, that has just been part of his story to get the candidates to follow his plan and free them from the evils of Jacob.
Thoughts?[/quote]
Certainly possible, but I don’t think D&C have been trying to trick us and that actually black=good and white=evil AND are going to tell us that Jacob has been keeping GOOD from the world all these years.
LostLove,
I think you hit the nail on the head. There is no way that Aaron is consistently mentioned without a subplot.
Now with only four left, actually three because Kate is not a candidate anymore, who will it be? Anyone have any guesses?
Post #11 and #56 I’ve been thinking about these things for awhile now. I still think there’s some meaning behind the psychic’s words. The crazy mother theme is meaningful too.
All along it was obvious MIB intended to have all the remaining candidates killed. I never believed he wanted them all to leave with him. He’s a liar and a manipulator. We saw Kate’s name crossed out on the dial in the Lighthouse, so what Sawyer told her about the cave wasn’t a surprise. Not sure about Claire but I would assume she was no longer a candidate either. Kate is still around to influence Jack and Sawyer’s decisions (whether it’s MIB or Widmore)so she’s useful for now. Does anyone else feel there’s an underlying reason Flocke is protecting Claire? IS it because of Aaron or does MIB need her for the time being such as to influence Kate? I don’t think it’s because she reminds him of his mommy.
FTR, I am agreeing (and always have) that Aaron is yet important to the story and it’s obvious that is the reason MIB keeps Claire safe. I just don’t think Aaron=MIB.
[quote comment=”374024″]LostLove,
Now with only four left, actually three because Kate is not a candidate anymore, who will it be?
[/quote]
Don’t count Desmond out.
Hugo is the next one to croak. Then the show falls back to its basic premise — the love/hate triangle between James & Jack & a big slice of Kate, in the middle of that three-way sandwich.
[quote comment=”374021″]I have to disagree that unlock is the bad guy. I believe it is Jacob. If the MIB can be a smoke monster, why can’t Jacob also be a smoke monster, and the actual one who has done most of the killings? We just assume it was the MIB who killed the sailors on Richards ship. Why couldn’t it have been Jacob? Because he says he is the good one? Remember, it is Jacobs that has brought people to island over the centuries to ultimately die, not the MIB.
Yes, Jin and Sun died on the island, but they didn’t die in the flash-sideways. Jin walks past Jack and Flocke into Sun’s hospital room at the end of the show. I believe they all have to die on the island for all of them to have their true (better) sideways life–the life they would have had if Jacob had not interfered in their lives. Unlock is not trying to leave the island, that has just been part of his story to get the candidates to follow his plan and free them from the evils of Jacob.
Thoughts?[/quote]
Aaaarrrrgggghhh! LOL
It has been said before, even earlier in this blog, that MIB is indeed evil!! The show’s creators even said this. LOST has been true to the following concept the whole way, (even though we didn’t learn of it until a few seasons ago): That this island is a stage for people who have done wrong in their lives to come to the island to redeem themselves. If they continue with their evil ways, the MIB wins. If someone, anyone, can understand that they have free will to choose to do something that is good, when faced with their own mortality, the MIW wins and the game is over. That this “game” has been going on for centuries tells us that everyone on the island falls into the trap the MIB creates. We have seen that the MIB wants to kill MIW, this will also cause the game to end. Knowing this, MIW keeps brnging people in to “do the right thing” or at worst, replace him to keep the MIB trapped on island. LOST has not strayed from this core concept. It is just that this was not known to the viewers until a few seasons in.
Can we finally move on from these alternate theories??
[quote comment=”373957″]Don’t Adam and Eve have those white and black stones in their pocket? So the implication is we will know who they are by knowing who has those stones.
I’ve thought for awhile that it must be Rose and Bernard, but I don’t see how that can be explained at all!![/quote]
Back in the beginning Jack took the pouch with the stones and put them in his pocket. I think he also said that someone had laid the man and woman there. Can’t really remember. Could it possibly be Jack that laid them to rest? I believe we will find out who they are because they brought the subject up again and the white and black stones are significant. As to who they are, it could be a number of people because nothing is impossible on LOST.
[quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
——-
How would Flocke know how to pilot a Jet …and land it? Just before landing he turns to smoke? Or maybe all he needs to do is get a short distance from the island before it’s armageddon time.
Wonder why Widmore didn’t just cut the planes tires and have all the guards around the Sub…
OR
…take the Sub off shore some distance off shore with the Losties while he had them so no one could get to the Sub and the Losties.
Seems the Losties dying is what Flocke needs to escape….but he himself (itself) cannot harm the Losties. That will come into play soon as there’s sure to be a Flocke vs Surviving Losties showdown.
Will the Losties now hook up with Widmore now they know Flocke is a super Baddie?
Instead of making all kissy kissy why didn’t Jin look around for a pry bar?
Was wondrin why Sun and Jin were speaking English at the end…they finally went to Korean for a moment…which is what the whole exchange should have been in as it’s the language they were speaking their whole lives.
Note to the actor playing Jack;
Moving your knoggin around all the time like a bobble head is not good acting technique;
it just looks contrived. The Horror!
Well, some nice action this episode.
looks like Widmore lost most of his Army…hope the families get Death Benefits. Widmore might have to action off part of his crappy Art Collection.
Looks like he’s gonna need that plane himself.
Funny comment by Sawyer re “Dough Boy”.
I didn’t notice Tina Fey…was she visible..did she get shot?
Be funny to put a little button on her Lapel that says “Feelin’ No Palin.”
Why didn’t the big Electronic things keep Smokey away?
Or do they just work on Polar Bears?
LostLove;
Maybe stick to Disney movies and cartoons if FICTIONAL stories with people dying gets to you.
Tragedy is pretty much the basis for a whole lotta Drama. Just because the babysitter watches doesn’t mean the kids should.
Jeffk; You may be right; that theory would be quite a turnaround too. But either way…we will get someone previously thought to be a Bad Guy come out in the end as a Good Guy and I’m betting on Widmore as a Good Guy …not Flocke.
Does anyone know who the name of the sail boat “Elizabeth” is named after? I thought Flock said it was his boat?
[quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″]I have to disagree that unlock is the bad guy. I believe it is Jacob. If the MIB can be a smoke monster, why can’t Jacob also be a smoke monster, and the actual one who has done most of the killings? We just assume it was the MIB who killed the sailors on Richards ship. Why couldn’t it have been Jacob? Because he says he is the good one? Remember, it is Jacobs that has brought people to island over the centuries to ultimately die, not the MIB.
Yes, Jin and Sun died on the island, but they didn’t die in the flash-sideways. Jin walks past Jack and Flocke into Sun’s hospital room at the end of the show. I believe they all have to die on the island for all of them to have their true (better) sideways life–the life they would have had if Jacob had not interfered in their lives. Unlock is not trying to leave the island, that has just been part of his story to get the candidates to follow his plan and free them from the evils of Jacob.
Thoughts?[/quote]
Aaaarrrrgggghhh! LOL
It has been said before, even earlier in this blog, that MIB is indeed evil!! The show’s creators even said this. LOST has been true to the following concept the whole way, (even though we didn’t learn of it until a few seasons ago): That this island is a stage for people who have done wrong in their lives to come to the island to redeem themselves. If they continue with their evil ways, the MIB wins. If someone, anyone, can understand that they have free will to choose to do something that is good, when faced with their own mortality, the MIW wins and the game is over. That this “game” has been going on for centuries tells us that everyone on the island falls into the trap the MIB creates. We have seen that the MIB wants to kill MIW, this will also cause the game to end. Knowing this, MIW keeps brnging people in to “do the right thing” or at worst, replace him to keep the MIB trapped on island. LOST has not strayed from this core concept. It is just that this was not known to the viewers until a few seasons in.
Can we finally move on from these alternate theories??[/quote]
I think “moving on from alternate theories”, in other words, discounting anything beyond simplistic interpretations of what’s been on TV or what the producers may have said would be a mistake.
Not that I think D&C weren’t honest in their statment that MIB is “evil” and Jacob is “good”, but I sure believe that they will make us question our normative definitions of “good” and “evil” (hence the quotation marks).
However “good” Jacob may be, he’s sure not above using deceit, violence, and, I believe, selfishness to achieve his brand of good.
I think this is the spirit of these “alternate theories” and I think it’s worth thinking about. The labels of “good” and “evil” may be correctly placed on Jacob and MIB, but I think we’ll end up questioning our definitions of those labels.
[quote comment=”374032″][quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″]I have to disagree that unlock is the bad guy. I believe it is Jacob. If the MIB can be a smoke monster, why can’t Jacob also be a smoke monster, and the actual one who has done most of the killings? We just assume it was the MIB who killed the sailors on Richards ship. Why couldn’t it have been Jacob? Because he says he is the good one? Remember, it is Jacobs that has brought people to island over the centuries to ultimately die, not the MIB.
Yes, Jin and Sun died on the island, but they didn’t die in the flash-sideways. Jin walks past Jack and Flocke into Sun’s hospital room at the end of the show. I believe they all have to die on the island for all of them to have their true (better) sideways life–the life they would have had if Jacob had not interfered in their lives. Unlock is not trying to leave the island, that has just been part of his story to get the candidates to follow his plan and free them from the evils of Jacob.
Thoughts?[/quote]
Aaaarrrrgggghhh! LOL
It has been said before, even earlier in this blog, that MIB is indeed evil!! The show’s creators even said this. LOST has been true to the following concept the whole way, (even though we didn’t learn of it until a few seasons ago): That this island is a stage for people who have done wrong in their lives to come to the island to redeem themselves. If they continue with their evil ways, the MIB wins. If someone, anyone, can understand that they have free will to choose to do something that is good, when faced with their own mortality, the MIW wins and the game is over. That this “game” has been going on for centuries tells us that everyone on the island falls into the trap the MIB creates. We have seen that the MIB wants to kill MIW, this will also cause the game to end. Knowing this, MIW keeps brnging people in to “do the right thing” or at worst, replace him to keep the MIB trapped on island. LOST has not strayed from this core concept. It is just that this was not known to the viewers until a few seasons in.
Can we finally move on from these alternate theories??[/quote]
I think “moving on from alternate theories”, in other words, discounting anything beyond simplistic interpretations of what’s been on TV or what the producers may have said would be a mistake.
Not that I think D&C weren’t honest in their statment that MIB is “evil” and Jacob is “good”, but I sure believe that they will make us question our normative definitions of “good” and “evil” (hence the quotation marks).
However “good” Jacob may be, he’s sure not above using deceit, violence, and, I believe, selfishness to achieve his brand of good.
I think this is the spirit of these “alternate theories” and I think it’s worth thinking about. The labels of “good” and “evil” may be correctly placed on Jacob and MIB, but I think we’ll end up questioning our definitions of those labels.[/quote]
Also, in many religions the devil, though the epitome of evil, actually sort operates as the ultimate friend to humanity – wanting people to live according to their true nature; to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
I think D&C may be operating with this more veiled definition of evil, as opposed to the hellfire-type one…
Just a thought
[quote comment=”374030″][quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
——-
How would Flocke know how to pilot a Jet …and land it? Just before landing he turns to smoke? Or maybe all he needs to do is get a short distance from the island before it’s armageddon time.
Wonder why Widmore didn’t just cut the planes tires and have all the guards around the Sub…
OR
…take the Sub off shore some distance off shore with the Losties while he had them so no one could get to the Sub and the Losties.
Seems the Losties dying is what Flocke needs to escape….but he himself (itself) cannot harm the Losties. That will come into play soon as there’s sure to be a Flocke vs Surviving Losties showdown.
Will the Losties now hook up with Widmore now they know Flocke is a super Baddie?
Instead of making all kissy kissy why didn’t Jin look around for a pry bar?
Was wondrin why Sun and Jin were speaking English at the end…they finally went to Korean for a moment…which is what the whole exchange should have been in as it’s the language they were speaking their whole lives.
Note to the actor playing Jack;
Moving your knoggin around all the time like a bobble head is not good acting technique;
it just looks contrived. The Horror!
Well, some nice action this episode.
looks like Widmore lost most of his Army…hope the families get Death Benefits. Widmore might have to action off part of his crappy Art Collection.
Looks like he’s gonna need that plane himself.
Funny comment by Sawyer re “Dough Boy”.
I didn’t notice Tina Fey…was she visible..did she get shot?
Be funny to put a little button on her Lapel that says “Feelin’ No Palin.”
Why didn’t the big Electronic things keep Smokey away?
Or do they just work on Polar Bears?
LostLove;
Maybe stick to Disney movies and cartoons if FICTIONAL stories with people dying gets to you.
Tragedy is pretty much the basis for a whole lotta Drama. Just because the babysitter watches doesn’t mean the kids should.
Jeffk; You may be right; that theory would be quite a turnaround too. But either way…we will get someone previously thought to be a Bad Guy come out in the end as a Good Guy and I’m betting on Widmore as a Good Guy …not Flocke.[/quote]
Bobola, please re-read the posts above, I believe you misquoted me or attributed something previously said as mine. As far as your other points, please read previous posts to answer some of your questions or watch the show.
[However “good” Jacob may be, he’s sure not above using deceit, violence, and, I believe, selfishness to achieve his brand of good.
Interesting thoughts, but if you give me examples of Jacob using deceit, violence and selfishness, I’ll give you examples of where he didn’t interfere and let free will take its course.
I agree with some of the previous posts. Somehow I don’t think MIB needs that plane at all. I didn’t think Lapidus was still around because he was a pilot. I didn’t want him to die but I couldn’t understand what his purpose was. He mentioned awhile back all the things that were damaged on the plane. Even if it was able to fly, how could he turn it around and I don’t think the runway was long enough. Yet last night Lapidus was going to see what he could do? Could MIB fly it because of what we saw in the FSW with Locke? Also in S1, Jack told Kate he had taken some flying lessons. Jack is determined to stay on the island now and MIB can’t force him to pilot the plane. Sayid wasn’t going to force Jack because after his talk with Desmond, he was no longer acting like a zombie. PLUS everyone exploding on the plane except maybe Jack, wouldn’t have pulled our heartstrings like what happened on the sub. The Sun and Jin death scene was right up there with Boone, Charlie, Daniel and Juliet dying. Sayid dying any other way other than going out as a hero wouldn’t be fitting to the Sayid we’ve grown to love.
Also, in many religions the devil, though the epitome of evil, actually sort operates as the ultimate friend to humanity – wanting people to live according to their true nature; to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
I think D&C may be operating with this more veiled definition of evil, as opposed to the hellfire-type one…
Just a thought[/quote]
Again, interesting. Besides possibly the religion of devil-worship, what other religion teaches that the devil is a friend to humanity??
If you are simply stating that the devil doesn’t hit us over the head luring into hell, but rather trying to trick us by using earthly and materialistic things (hmmm fLocke??) than I agree w/ your general idea.
[quote comment=”374015″][quote comment=”374012″]
there are still plenty of other people on the island to kill someone if they are left behind…its not like MIB is pressed for time
[/quote]
Well no, he’s not pressed for time. But his plan was great on paper…get them all together with a bomb and see if THEY eliminate themselves all at once….mission accomplished. He didn’t account for Sayid switching sides again. Plan B is using the “plenty of other people on the island to kill…”.[/quote]
I have a feeling that MIB is very much in a hurry.
[quote comment=”374035″][However “good” Jacob may be, he’s sure not above using deceit, violence, and, I believe, selfishness to achieve his brand of good.
Interesting thoughts, but if you give me examples of Jacob using deceit, violence and selfishness, I’ll give you examples of where he didn’t interfere and let free will take its course.[/quote]
I should have used the word manipulation instead of deceit, but that one’s easy: it’s clear that he has, on several occasions, purposely brought people to the island in order to prove some thesis of his. In order to do so, the purported “king of free-will” actively and intentionally interferes with the course of people’s lives. Once he gets them to the island, he’s all like, “whoa, I can’t get involved. Free will reigns…” Using others in order to validate your own point, however righteous that point may be, is manipulative and selfish.
He is not above violence either. I remember him kicking Alpert’s a** on the beach when they first met. I would also argue that complete inaction when one knows someone else is in imminent danger as qualifying as condoning violence.
The hands-off free will reigns approach seems really noble on its face, but when the person who doesn’t get involved is also the one who instigated the volatile situation in the first place, I think one has to take pause and question things a little more.
[\quote] to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
[/quote]
Doesn’t living “unrestricted and according to every whim” generally lead to “death, destruction and misery” when it is taken to its limit?
[quote comment=”374031″]Does anyone know who the name of the sail boat “Elizabeth” is named after? I thought Flock said it was his boat?[/quote]
It was named for Libby by her husband.
Hammer, somehow I don’t think MIB=Aaron either although I’m waiting to see how Aaron and David fit into all of this. Did they show us David for nothing?
If MIB’s name is Esau I will be very disappointed. It’s too simple even though the story kind of fits. Twins fighting in Rebekah’s womb and would continue to fight all their lives and later they became two separate nations. Supposedly whenever she would pass a house of Torah study, Jacob would struggle to come out; whenever she would pass a house of idolatry, Esau would agitate to come out. (Silly since she would have no way of knowing which child was even moving or kicking.) According to prophecy the older would serve the younger; has been taken to mean that the two nations would never gain power simultaneously: when one fell, the other would rise, and vice versa. Flocke says he had a crazy mother but Jacob and Esau’s mother Rebekah was not crazy.
Just to let you guys know who are concerned there’s only 3 eps left and thus only 3 hours, I read today that the finale is now 2.5 hours long, so at least we have a little more time (4.5 hours total) for more – but probably not all – answers to be revealed.
I mean, c’mon, it’s LOST, there’s no way they’re going to leave us asking NO questions.
Personally I’m excited to find out what they’ll leave us theorising.
[quote comment=”374037″]Also, in many religions the devil, though the epitome of evil, actually sort operates as the ultimate friend to humanity – wanting people to live according to their true nature; to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
I think D&C may be operating with this more veiled definition of evil, as opposed to the hellfire-type one…
Just a thought[/quote]
Again, interesting. Besides possibly the religion of devil-worship, what other religion teaches that the devil is a friend to humanity??
If you are simply stating that the devil doesn’t hit us over the head luring into hell, but rather trying to trick us by using earthly and materialistic things (hmmm fLocke??) than I agree w/ your general idea.[/quote]
[quote comment=”374040″][\quote] to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
[/quote]
Doesn’t living “unrestricted and according to every whim” generally lead to “death, destruction and misery” when it is taken to its limit?[/quote]
Yes, exactly. That’s the point. I’m not arguing that the MIB is not representative of evil, but I am arguing that we may be led to question our definition of evil – and even moreso our definition of good.
I do think Jacob is meant to represent “good”, but I also think we will be led to question the completeness of his goodness (and by extension, our definition of what good is) As I alluded to before, Jacob is not the one pulling the trigger, but he’s the one that handed out the guns, so to speak.
I have not seen this posted but D & C are going to do a live show in movie theaters. “Times talk live Lost” it is one day only Thursday May 29th right before the show ends. Click on the link for more info. You will need to look for a theater near you. Hope the link works
http://www.fandango.com/timestalkslive:lost_132325/movieoverview?date=
[quote comment=”374034″][quote
Bobola, please re-read the posts above, I believe you misquoted me or attributed something previously said as mine. As far as your other points, please read previous posts to answer some of your questions or watch the show.[/quote]
Well, no reason to get snippy just cuz I mistook you for lizzy1220…clearly you could have just written that.
I’m posting here in haste; I don’t have all day and stuff happens. Isn’t it all the more annoying for you to repeat my entire under your post…I mean YOU just did the very thing you’re getting on my case about.
Not very helpful.
[quote comment=”374033″][quote comment=”374032″][quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″][/quote]
Also, in many religions the devil, though the epitome of evil, actually sort operates as the ultimate friend to humanity – wanting people to live according to their true nature; to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
I think D&C may be operating with this more veiled definition of evil, as opposed to the hellfire-type one…
Just a thought[/quote][/quote][/quote]
Hold on–WHAT religions are you talking about? The epitome of evil acts as the ultimate friend to humanity? Please explain what you mean by this as I do not get it at all.
The devil wants you to live according to your true nature? Yah, I don’t think so. I think the devil wants you to mess up and delights when you do. And the worse you behave to your fellow humans, the happier he is. ‘See, G? This creature you made is a WRETCHED, pitiful mistake! I can prove it to you ANY day of the week, and twice on Sunday.’
Well, that’s one version of the Devil, the one where he’s arguing with God about the worth of humans, and God boots him out of heaven, and the Devil thereafter occupies himself with the ruin of souls.
It sounds like you been listening to the Devil’s version of who he is, my friend. ; )
We saw Hurley take the pouch with Jacob’s ashes from Ilana’s belongings. Uh, ashes dissipate in water. Did he put them in a waterproof container when we weren’t looking? There has to be a reason why he took the ashes.
I don’t know if I buy into Widmore working with Flocke. I think Widmore is evil and has his own agenda. Even though he told Jin about not wanting MIB to get off the island because their loved ones would cease to exist, he has tried getting back to the island for a long time and I think it’s for selfish reasons. Maybe it’s different this time idk. The list of good things he’s done is short. One of the worst things that comes to mind is him ordering a younger Ben to kill Rousseau’s baby, Alex. WHY? I never could figure that one out. Even Ben wouldn’t do it.
He’s puzzling to me though. It appeared he didn’t care about our LOSTIES or his own people for that matter since those sonic fences had been working fine up until then. On the other hand did he really believe they were safe in the cages? He told them it was for their own good. If Jack opened the lock with the key, couldn’t MIB open them as well and lure them away to be killed? Apparently Widmore was hiding in the Hydra Station probably surrounded with a sonic fence. What exactly is he up to? Does he know how to kill, contain or render MIB powerless?
He did bring Desmond back seemingly for good but it was against his will. Why did he do that? Does Widmore know Desmond has to die or remain on the island? I sure hope not and I could see why Des wouldn’t come willingly. I just don’t trust him at all. What is his plan? Flocke couldn’t kill Desmond and told Sayid to do it. Besides the whole electromagnetism thing, Desmond is a candidate right? I’m anxious to see what the purpose is for bringing Desmond back.
[quote comment=”373974″]Big answer revealed: Absolutely fLocke needed them to kill themselves all along… finally confirmed. They worked it in there too without slapping our faces with it.
on Aaron: If Widmore didn’t bring Aaron to the island with him, then he’s still in Claires bellayyyy. The world they left behind is gone, and it is 2004 in the sideways. …Speaking of Widmore, where the hell did he go?
.[/quote]
Perhaps fLocke needs the candidates to kill each other off of the island. Hence the sub, instead of Widmore bullets, and missiles.
Widmore from 2004 FSW? He snatched Des from the hospital after Ben shot him in 2004. It does look like the Widmore from FSW. He has light blue eyes, not the spooky dark blue eyes from the original timeline.
[quote comment=”374048″][quote comment=”373974″]Big answer revealed: Absolutely fLocke needed them to kill themselves all along… finally confirmed. They worked it in there too without slapping our faces with it.
on Aaron: If Widmore didn’t bring Aaron to the island with him, then he’s still in Claires bellayyyy. The world they left behind is gone, and it is 2004 in the sideways. …Speaking of Widmore, where the hell did he go?
.[/quote]
Perhaps fLocke needs the candidates to kill each other off of the island. Hence the sub, instead of Widmore bullets, and missiles.
Widmore from 2004 FSW? He snatched Des from the hospital after Ben shot him in 2004. It does look like the Widmore from FSW. He has light blue eyes, not the spooky dark blue eyes from the original timeline.[/quote]
I meant from the hospital in 2007.
[quote comment=”374046″][quote comment=”374033″][quote comment=”374032″][quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″][/quote]
Also, in many religions the devil, though the epitome of evil, actually sort operates as the ultimate friend to humanity – wanting people to live according to their true nature; to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
I think D&C may be operating with this more veiled definition of evil, as opposed to the hellfire-type one…
Just a thought[/quote][/quote][/quote]
Hold on–WHAT religions are you talking about? The epitome of evil acts as the ultimate friend to humanity? Please explain what you mean by this as I do not get it at all.
The devil wants you to live according to your true nature? Yah, I don’t think so. I think the devil wants you to mess up and delights when you do. And the worse you behave to your fellow humans, the happier he is. ‘See, G? This creature you made is a WRETCHED, pitiful mistake! I can prove it to you ANY day of the week, and twice on Sunday.’
Well, that’s one version of the Devil, the one where he’s arguing with God about the worth of humans, and God boots him out of heaven, and the Devil thereafter occupies himself with the ruin of souls.
It sounds like you been listening to the Devil’s version of who he is, my friend. ; )[/quote]
No, I’m not saying that the Devil is a good guy. When I say he is depicted as the friend of humanity, I’m referencing the means to which he achieves his end. Where God says abstain from this and that, the Devil says trust your instincts, do what you want, etc. In that way, he is oftentimes depicted as a champion of unabridged human nature. It’s true that in Christianity, he’s doing this because his thesis is that human nature is essentially flawed and getting people to follow it all the time will lead their souls into his control.
In other religions, Satan is not an entity per se, but rather representative of the darker parts of human nature. In some forms of Satanism, Satan is the personification of free will, not death and destruction. I know that Satan has also been characterized as an agent of God, meant to sort of flush out those who are not worthy of his gifts…
Feel free to educate yourself on world religions. I’m not a scholar (or any kind of religious weirdo) but I have spent time reading about how other cultures view good and evil and it’s not always as black and white as it first seems. Read about the story of Job, for example. I’m not going to accuse god of being bad, but to allow one of his beloved humans to be tormented in any way that Satan sees fit in order to prove a point about the goodness of humankind must at least raise your eyebrows….unless you are a champion of “the end always justifies the means…”
Anyway, my whole point is that the question of good and evil gets more complicated when you zoom in and look at what’s actually being done to achieve “good” and what’s being done to achieve “evil”. I think D&C are intrigued by a more worldview (and not just an American Christian one) of good v. evil (the use of hieroglyphics, e.g.) and I think that will be brought to bear when fleshing out the characters of Jacob and MIB.
Here is what the show is about if the link does not work. It’s in my city it is playing at Edwards theatre’s Don’t miss this compelling in-depth conversation with the masterminds behind ABC’s “Lost.” Hear executive producer Carlton Cuse and co-creator/executive producer Damon Lindelof reveal the challenges of crafting a finale that satisfies themselves as storytellers, and the show’s legion of fans.
They will be interviewed by New York Times entertainment editor Lorne Manly and the event will be broadcast Live via satellite from The TimesCenter in New York for only one night, on Thursday, May 20, at 8pmET / 7pmCT / 6pmMT and tape delayed at 8pmPT exclusively to select movie theaters across the U.S. and Canada
I think that everyone is analyzing this show in way too much detail. One cannot have a perplexing storyline in such a short amount of episodes. The producers did the show a disservice with seasons two and three. They were just filler shows with very little of the episodes interlinking. IMHO, every show should have something in relation to the ultimate storyline. Otherwise, it is a wasted episode.
(Steps off soap box)
Who is next?
[quote comment=”374050″][quote comment=”374046″][quote comment=”374033″][quote comment=”374032″][quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″][/quote]
Also, in many religions the devil, though the epitome of evil, actually sort operates as the ultimate friend to humanity – wanting people to live according to their true nature; to live unrestricted and according every whim….more like a really bad parent than the bringer of death, destruction and misery…
I think D&C may be operating with this more veiled definition of evil, as opposed to the hellfire-type one…
Just a thought[/quote][/quote][/quote]
Hold on–WHAT religions are you talking about? The epitome of evil acts as the ultimate friend to humanity? Please explain what you mean by this as I do not get it at all.
The devil wants you to live according to your true nature? Yah, I don’t think so. I think the devil wants you to mess up and delights when you do. And the worse you behave to your fellow humans, the happier he is. ‘See, G? This creature you made is a WRETCHED, pitiful mistake! I can prove it to you ANY day of the week, and twice on Sunday.’
Well, that’s one version of the Devil, the one where he’s arguing with God about the worth of humans, and God boots him out of heaven, and the Devil thereafter occupies himself with the ruin of souls.
It sounds like you been listening to the Devil’s version of who he is, my friend. ; )[/quote]
No, I’m not saying that the Devil is a good guy. When I say he is depicted as the friend of humanity, I’m referencing the means to which he achieves his end. Where God says abstain from this and that, the Devil says trust your instincts, do what you want, etc. In that way, he is oftentimes depicted as a champion of unabridged human nature. It’s true that in Christianity, he’s doing this because his thesis is that human nature is essentially flawed and getting people to follow it all the time will lead their souls into his control.
In other religions, Satan is not an entity per se, but rather representative of the darker parts of human nature. In some forms of Satanism, Satan is the personification of free will, not death and destruction. I know that Satan has also been characterized as an agent of God, meant to sort of flush out those who are not worthy of his gifts…
Feel free to educate yourself on world religions. I’m not a scholar (or any kind of religious weirdo) but I have spent time reading about how other cultures view good and evil and it’s not always as black and white as it first seems. Read about the story of Job, for example. I’m not going to accuse god of being bad, but to allow one of his beloved humans to be tormented in any way that Satan sees fit in order to prove a point about the goodness of humankind must at least raise your eyebrows….unless you are a champion of “the end always justifies the means…”
Anyway, my whole point is that the question of good and evil gets more complicated when you zoom in and look at what’s actually being done to achieve “good” and what’s being done to achieve “evil”. I think D&C are intrigued by a more worldview (and not just an American Christian one) of good v. evil (the use of hieroglyphics, e.g.) and I think that will be brought to bear when fleshing out the characters of Jacob and MIB.[/quote]
Well explained!!!!! Something to think about until next weeks awesome episode.
Speaking of Widmore, why the rush all of a sudden? Didn’t he put Des through that test prematurely, and Widmore’s group was being pushed at every turn, almost like something was happening or was going to happen that would get in the way. I don’t think it was just that fLocke was coming – something else. What could it be? Someone else coming to the island? The “boy” in the woods is growing up??
[quote comment=”374050″][quote comment=”374046″][quote comment=”374033″][quote comment=”374032″][quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″][/quote]
No, I’m not saying that the Devil is a good guy. When I say he is depicted as the friend of humanity, I’m referencing the means to which he achieves his end. Where God says abstain from this and that, the Devil says trust your instincts, do what you want, etc. In that way, he is oftentimes depicted as a champion of unabridged human nature. It’s true that in Christianity, he’s doing this because his thesis is that human nature is essentially flawed and getting people to follow it all the time will lead their souls into his control.
In other religions, Satan is not an entity per se, but rather representative of the darker parts of human nature. In some forms of Satanism, Satan is the personification of free will, not death and destruction. I know that Satan has also been characterized as an agent of God, meant to sort of flush out those who are not worthy of his gifts…
Feel free to educate yourself on world religions. I’m not a scholar (or any kind of religious weirdo) but I have spent time reading about how other cultures view good and evil and it’s not always as black and white as it first seems. Read about the story of Job, for example. I’m not going to accuse god of being bad, but to allow one of his beloved humans to be tormented in any way that Satan sees fit in order to prove a point about the goodness of humankind must at least raise your eyebrows….unless you are a champion of “the end always justifies the means…”
Anyway, my whole point is that the question of good and evil gets more complicated when you zoom in and look at what’s actually being done to achieve “good” and what’s being done to achieve “evil”. I think D&C are intrigued by a more worldview (and not just an American Christian one) of good v. evil (the use of hieroglyphics, e.g.) and I think that will be brought to bear when fleshing out the characters of Jacob and MIB.[/quote][/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
Hmm,the complicated MIB–what do we know about him?
He’s an entity, not a human being, who may possibly have once been human (according to him) who may possibly be the instrument of the destruction of the world if he gets off the Island (according to Whidmore, Eloise, & Richard & Jacob)
He has a big temper, and as Smokey has probably killed hundreds of folks. And he’s doing pretty good as fLocke, too, I must say.
MIB lies, he tricks, he promises, he’s got some mighty powers, he calls folks ‘his people’ but could care less about them once he’s ‘done’ with whatever he had in mind. Except for Claire. So far.
He says he has mommy issues.
Doesn’t he seem kinda sulky and whiney sometimes? Like a kid having a tantrum?
We know he’s bound to the Island (accd to Jacob, Richard, Whidmore, etc.) We know he’s been bound not to directly kill Jacob, or any ‘candidate’ by some rule he either agreed to or was forced to agree to, and which he abides by, or has no choice but to abide by, and his stated desire is to ‘go home’ whatever that means. And we don’t know what HOME is or how he’d get there (I guess not by plane or sub).
We can be certain of his hatred for Jacob. He worked centuries to find his loophole. So he learned patience, too. In his own sweet way.
I’m not saying he might not have some redeeming qualities, or that it might not become evident that there are reasons we might feel sympathy for his plight–but tell me what is the GOOD that he’s done? Can’t think of a thing.
OF COURSE it may not be as simple as MIB is the personification of Evil, and Jacob is what we’ve got as Good. We don’t know what their argument is. The fact that Jacob was trying to win a point–it only ends once, the rest is just..progress–WTH does that mean? Are our peops just pawns on their giant chess board? How annoying would that be?
Maybe MIB has a good reason to be pissed off. Who likes to be trapped in a cage, with bars or without? But he’s really not nice.
I would not say he had the best interests of humanity at heart.
ugh, sorry about the formatting of my post!!!
[quote comment=”373917″]Did anyone else notice that FS Locke, whispering in his sleep “I wish you had believed me”, then Jack saying to FS Locke “I wish you would believe me” as FS Locke was wheeling himself down the hall, seemed to trigger something in FS Locke as he heard Jack say those words? As if he was remembering it…[/quote]
It was those words that Locke wrote in his suicide not that Jack read on the Ajira flight.
[quote comment=”374048″][quote comment=”373974″]Big answer revealed: Absolutely fLocke needed them to kill themselves all along… finally confirmed. They worked it in there too without slapping our faces with it.
on Aaron: If Widmore didn’t bring Aaron to the island with him, then he’s still in Claires bellayyyy. The world they left behind is gone, and it is 2004 in the sideways. …Speaking of Widmore, where the hell did he go?
.[/quote]
Perhaps fLocke needs the candidates to kill each other off of the island. Hence the sub, instead of Widmore bullets, and missiles.
Widmore from 2004 FSW? He snatched Des from the hospital after Ben shot him in 2004. It does look like the Widmore from FSW. He has light blue eyes, not the spooky dark blue eyes from the original timeline.[/quote]
No way,,, Widmore is from 2007 in the original timeline… he crossed into the island before the Incident happened, anyone with him on the sub is not from the flash sideways. (I think!)
[quote comment=”374058″][quote comment=”373917″]Did anyone else notice that FS Locke, whispering in his sleep “I wish you had believed me”, then Jack saying to FS Locke “I wish you would believe me” as FS Locke was wheeling himself down the hall, seemed to trigger something in FS Locke as he heard Jack say those words? As if he was remembering it…[/quote]
It was those words that Locke wrote in his suicide not that Jack read on the Ajira flight.[/quote]
Take this for whatever its worth, but didn’t the whole “Push the button” “You should’ve believed me…” murmering sound like a cartoon wolf pretending to sound like a sheep? MIB anyone?
[quote comment=”374038″][quote comment=”374015″][quote comment=”374012″]
there are still plenty of other people on the island to kill someone if they are left behind…its not like MIB is pressed for time
[/quote]
Well no, he’s not pressed for time. But his plan was great on paper…get them all together with a bomb and see if THEY eliminate themselves all at once….mission accomplished. He didn’t account for Sayid switching sides again. Plan B is using the “plenty of other people on the island to kill…”.[/quote]
I have a feeling that MIB is very much in a hurry.[/quote]
Well yeah, there’s only 3 episodes left! 🙂
How about this: Ben replaces Jacob and Widmore replaces MIB…
[quote comment=”374061″][quote comment=”374038″][quote comment=”374015″][quote comment=”374012″]
there are still plenty of other people on the island to kill someone if they are left behind…its not like MIB is pressed for time
[/quote]
Well no, he’s not pressed for time. But his plan was great on paper…get them all together with a bomb and see if THEY eliminate themselves all at once….mission accomplished. He didn’t account for Sayid switching sides again. Plan B is using the “plenty of other people on the island to kill…”.[/quote]
I have a feeling that MIB is very much in a hurry.[/quote]
Well yeah, there’s only 3 episodes left! :-)[/quote]
It’s all trial and error on MIBs part…
I dont think that theres a carefully laid down plan for MIB. I think MIB doesnt figure out what the rules are until he breaks them, and I’m starting to think that the penance for breaking a rule for MIB might be that he ends up sentenced to more time… that scene on the beach with him and Jacob watching the Black Rock seems to symbolize MIB’s “skip”—if 2007 (2004 sideways) is his loop hole, maybe 1867 is the next groove in the record.
[quote comment=”373922″]ok so flocke doesnt need them to leave. He needs them dead to leave. But cant kill them. Also I miss Ben.
Also I want to see Jacob again he is so HOT!!! ok pefect ending for me would be everyone comes back to life and jack and kate end up together sawyer and juliet. charlie and claire. sayid and nadia. hugo and miss crazy pants. Ok and then they all live in a neighborhood together and are best of friends. Sit around drinking coffee talking about there crazy days on the island[/quote]
I love it. Sounds perfect!
[quote comment=”374062″]How about this: Ben replaces Jacob and Widmore replaces MIB…[/quote]
I like that idea. Couldn’t happen to two nicer guys. I don’t want to see Jack, Desmond or Locke “stuck” on the island in that role. Hurley or Sawyer either.
I’ll bet Richard regrets ever saying he wished that he’d never die. How lonely and depressing it would be outliving everyone around you and losing people you love.
Sorry, I haven’t read half the posts yet, so this may have been discussed already.
Why does MIB pick up his gun to go finish what he started, if he can’t kill our survivors?
[quote comment=”373974″]
Anthony Cooper was very interesting, being in that state.. I do say its payback. We still know that he was an awful man regardless of his relationship with Locke… without some more back story though… what do we know? It would be nice to see that maybe A.C. was responsible for his fate in that plane crash, Wile. E Coyote style…
[/quote]
We’ve seen the awful things he did to Locke. He pretended to be happy that they “found” each other in order to trick John into giving him a kidney. He setup the whole scheme using Locke’s mother. After he got what he wanted he threw John away like an old shoe. He conned those guys out of a couple hundred thousand dollars and then staged his own death to get them off his tail. John attends his funeral and says “I forgive you.” Cooper soon afterward approaches John at work and cons him into getting the money for him and tells John he’ll give him some for doing it. John delivers the money but Helen follows Locke and is very angry when she sees Cooper alive. Subsequently Helen refuses to marry Locke after seeing him being duped by his father again. Deep down John wanted to love and be loved by his father. The ultimate was Cooper shoving Locke out the window causing his paralysis. Then there’s James Ford (our Sawyer). Anthony Cooper going by the name of Sawyer sleeps with James’ mother and cons her out of all their money. James’ dad finds out and shoots her and himself as James hides under the bed. We don’t know how many other women and men he’s conned but we know it’s quite a few. So he royally screwed up Locke and Sawyer’s lives besides all the others. That’s enough back story for me.
[quote comment=”374066″]Sorry, I haven’t read half the posts yet, so this may have been discussed already.
Why does MIB pick up his gun to go finish what he started, if he can’t kill our survivors?[/quote]
The gun is for killing anyone else that gets in his way. Bullets can’t kill him but they seem to make him very annoyed. His patience has run out and he wants to get rid of the rest of the Candidates. Exactly how he plans on arranging this is anybody’s guess. They won’t be tricked so easily this time.
LizS –
I agree: there’s nothing that MIB has done so far that can be reasonably construed as “good” (except maybe lead Jack to water). Unless, of course, he ends up being the one telling all of our Losties the truth about the nature of the island and how it’s really just merely a proving grounds for a centuries old argument.
But I ask you: by your definition of good, what has Jacob done that can be outwardly interpreted as good? All we’ve seen from Jacob is basically the manipulation of others.
The whole reason I posted anything about good v. evil (about 60 posts and 6 hours ago) was to try and dismiss this simplistic notion of good and evil. I don’t think D&C would treat us so irreverently after 6 great seasons. It’s obvious that there are two parties who are diametrically opposed to one another, but outside of there personal argument, I expect to be challenged by the process of deciding who was right (good/righteous) and wrong (evil). After watching this show for 6 seasons, I don’t know why anyone would expect it to be so simple….
I think we’re in store for some serious gut-check type revelations…we’ll see.
[quote comment=”374068″][quote comment=”374066″]Sorry, I haven’t read half the posts yet, so this may have been discussed already.
Why does MIB pick up his gun to go finish what he started, if he can’t kill our survivors?[/quote]
The gun is for killing anyone else that gets in his way. Bullets can’t kill him but they seem to make him very annoyed. His patience has run out and he wants to get rid of the rest of the Candidates. Exactly how he plans on arranging this is anybody’s guess. They won’t be tricked so easily this time.[/quote]
Well at this point, at least Jack, Kate, Sawyer, and Hurley clearly know that what Jack said on the sub was true and that Flocke can’t just kill them; if it were that easy, he would have already done so. So they know that his plan is to get them all together and have them die. So Flocke, in my opinion, will now go to Ben/Alpert/Miles and try to trick them into basically killing the remaining candidates, since he obviously must know that the remaining 4 would never trust a word Flocke says anymore.
[quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″]
[/quote]
Aaaarrrrgggghhh! LOL
It has been said before, even earlier in this blog, that MIB is indeed evil!! The show’s creators even said this. LOST has been true to the following concept the whole way, (even though we didn’t learn of it until a few seasons ago): That this island is a stage for people who have done wrong in their lives to come to the island to redeem themselves. If they continue with their evil ways, the MIB wins. If someone, anyone, can understand that they have free will to choose to do something that is good, when faced with their own mortality, the MIW wins and the game is over. That this “game” has been going on for centuries tells us that everyone on the island falls into the trap the MIB creates. We have seen that the MIB wants to kill MIW, this will also cause the game to end. Knowing this, MIW keeps brnging people in to “do the right thing” or at worst, replace him to keep the MIB trapped on island. LOST has not strayed from this core concept. It is just that this was not known to the viewers until a few seasons in.
Can we finally move on from these alternate theories??[/quote]
Ok not sure if this will make sense, but I think that the candidates who are left are the ones who have changed their life and done good in the FSW. For instance, Sawyer is now a cop. Although he still plans on killing Anthony Cooper, he hasn’t done it yet. Hurley used his money for good. Perhaps Kate was crossed off because in her FSW she is still a murderer. I’m not sure if Jack and Sun/Jin fall into this also, but it seems like Jack is different in his FSW. He’s a man of faith maybe?
Anyway, I have just read all 200+ posts in one sitting and could just be delirious and convincing myself that this really makes sense.
[quote comment=”374071″][quote comment=”374028″][quote comment=”374021″]
[/quote]
Aaaarrrrgggghhh! LOL
It has been said before, even earlier in this blog, that MIB is indeed evil!! The show’s creators even said this. LOST has been true to the following concept the whole way, (even though we didn’t learn of it until a few seasons ago): That this island is a stage for people who have done wrong in their lives to come to the island to redeem themselves. If they continue with their evil ways, the MIB wins. If someone, anyone, can understand that they have free will to choose to do something that is good, when faced with their own mortality, the MIW wins and the game is over. That this “game” has been going on for centuries tells us that everyone on the island falls into the trap the MIB creates. We have seen that the MIB wants to kill MIW, this will also cause the game to end. Knowing this, MIW keeps brnging people in to “do the right thing” or at worst, replace him to keep the MIB trapped on island. LOST has not strayed from this core concept. It is just that this was not known to the viewers until a few seasons in.
Can we finally move on from these alternate theories??[/quote]
Ok not sure if this will make sense, but I think that the candidates who are left are the ones who have changed their life and done good in the FSW. For instance, Sawyer is now a cop. Although he still plans on killing Anthony Cooper, he hasn’t done it yet. Hurley used his money for good. Perhaps Kate was crossed off because in her FSW she is still a murderer. I’m not sure if Jack and Sun/Jin fall into this also, but it seems like Jack is different in his FSW. He’s a man of faith maybe?
Anyway, I have just read all 200+ posts in one sitting and could just be delirious and convincing myself that this really makes sense.[/quote]
Oh and I forgot to add that if these candidates who have changed their life on the FSW leaves the island, then Jacob wins.
[quote comment=”374024″]LostLove,
I think you hit the nail on the head. There is no way that Aaron is consistently mentioned without a subplot.
Now with only four left, actually three because Kate is not a candidate anymore, who will it be? Anyone have any guesses?[/quote]
_____________________________________
Anyone wondering why Kate is no longer a candidate? I wonder what she did/didn’t do to take her off the list….
[quote comment=”374061″][quote comment=”374038″][quote comment=”374015″][quote comment=”374012″]
there are still plenty of other people on the island to kill someone if they are left behind…its not like MIB is pressed for time
[/quote]
Well no, he’s not pressed for time. But his plan was great on paper…get them all together with a bomb and see if THEY eliminate themselves all at once….mission accomplished. He didn’t account for Sayid switching sides again. Plan B is using the “plenty of other people on the island to kill…”.[/quote]
I have a feeling that MIB is very much in a hurry.[/quote]
Well yeah, there’s only 3 episodes left! :-)[/quote]
Ok, but that’s not the only reason 😉
I think he is in a hurry because of the boy in the jungle. That boy grows old very fast and last time he appeared he looked like young Jacob.
[quote comment=”374067″][quote comment=”373974″]
Anthony Cooper was very interesting, being in that state.. I do say its payback. We still know that he was an awful man regardless of his relationship with Locke… without some more back story though… what do we know? It would be nice to see that maybe A.C. was responsible for his fate in that plane crash, Wile. E Coyote style…
[/quote]
We’ve seen the awful things he did to Locke. He pretended to be happy that they “found” each other in order to trick John into giving him a kidney. He setup the whole scheme using Locke’s mother. After he got what he wanted he threw John away like an old shoe. He conned those guys out of a couple hundred thousand dollars and then staged his own death to get them off his tail. John attends his funeral and says “I forgive you.” Cooper soon afterward approaches John at work and cons him into getting the money for him and tells John he’ll give him some for doing it. John delivers the money but Helen follows Locke and is very angry when she sees Cooper alive. Subsequently Helen refuses to marry Locke after seeing him being duped by his father again. Deep down John wanted to love and be loved by his father. The ultimate was Cooper shoving Locke out the window causing his paralysis. Then there’s James Ford (our Sawyer). Anthony Cooper going by the name of Sawyer sleeps with James’ mother and cons her out of all their money. James’ dad finds out and shoots her and himself as James hides under the bed. We don’t know how many other women and men he’s conned but we know it’s quite a few. So he royally screwed up Locke and Sawyer’s lives besides all the others. That’s enough back story for me.[/quote]
Wooooooo! well- I meant that in the alt world things might have been different,,, but we have no back story to prove one way or the other… but you are right, he was probably still a total douche anyway, and if Locke hadn’t f’d him up, he would have been even more so.
[quote comment=”374039″][quote comment=”374035″][However “good” Jacob may be, he’s sure not above using deceit, violence, and, I believe, selfishness to achieve his brand of good.
Interesting thoughts, but if you give me examples of Jacob using deceit, violence and selfishness, I’ll give you examples of where he didn’t interfere and let free will take its course.[/quote]
I should have used the word manipulation instead of deceit, but that one’s easy: it’s clear that he has, on several occasions, purposely brought people to the island in order to prove some thesis of his. In order to do so, the purported “king of free-will” actively and intentionally interferes with the course of people’s lives. Once he gets them to the island, he’s all like, “whoa, I can’t get involved. Free will reigns…” Using others in order to validate your own point, however righteous that point may be, is manipulative and selfish.
He is not above violence either. I remember him kicking Alpert’s a** on the beach when they first met. I would also argue that complete inaction when one knows someone else is in imminent danger as qualifying as condoning violence.
The hands-off free will reigns approach seems really noble on its face, but when the person who doesn’t get involved is also the one who instigated the volatile situation in the first place, I think one has to take pause and question things a little more.[/quote]
I can understand how so many people are knocking Jacob for interfering with peoples lives… but I think you have to look at it from a different angle…
just a theory now:
These people have given up their choice to live in the world, for whatever reason.
The island doesn’t choose people because they are golden gods, it chooses people because for one reason or another –they deserve to be there.
Consider Hurley: great guy, but he’s cursed, and his good luck turns into bad luck for others. He cannot be a part of society any longer.
Locke: He fell out of a building. He should be dead.
Sayid: Murderer… I wont go on, but you get my point
[quote comment=”374074″][quote comment=”374061″][quote comment=”374038″]
I have a feeling that MIB is very much in a hurry.[/quote]
Well yeah, there’s only 3 episodes left! :-)[/quote]
Ok, but that’s not the only reason 😉
I think he is in a hurry because of the boy in the jungle. That boy grows old very fast and last time he appeared he looked like young Jacob.[/quote]
Agreed… he also can’t trick them anymore b/c they know he’s trying to kill them, not help them escape. Can’t wait to see how Des fits into this.
[quote comment=”374069″]LizS –
…
But I ask you: by your definition of good, what has Jacob done that can be outwardly interpreted as good? All we’ve seen from Jacob is basically the manipulation of others.
The whole reason I posted anything about good v. evil (about 60 posts and 6 hours ago) was to try and dismiss this simplistic notion of good and evil. I don’t think D&C would treat us so irreverently after 6 great seasons. It’s obvious that there are two parties who are diametrically opposed to one another, but outside of there personal argument, I expect to be challenged by the process of deciding who was right (good/righteous) and wrong (evil). After watching this show for 6 seasons, I don’t know why anyone would expect it to be so simple….
I think we’re in store for some serious gut-check type revelations…we’ll see.[/quote]
I hope so on the Revelations front! I expect it and would be disappointed if we don’t get that.
“But I ask you: by your definition of good…”
LOL, not going there! I’m long winded enough.
re: Jacob–I’ve had problems with Jacob and what he does/doesn’t do in the past, because he brings people to the Island w/o explanation, and just lets stuff happen to them w/o interfering (MUCH). And he obviously has the cards in his hands of knowledge and purpose.
Is that ‘good’ for humans? Well, there’s a stack of bodies that say not so much.
HOWEVER–now that we’ve seen more of Jacob and know much more about him (which is still not a lot), I see more of good in him. We don’t know what the argument is, granted, but it has world shattering consequences, we believe.
Jacob seems to have developed compassion as time went on. Or maybe he always had it, I dunno. He seems different from the time he met Richard to now.
He’s ‘trapped’ by the Island as MIB is, but maybe that was by his own choice, his free will. He never abandons The Argument, even when he leaves the island, he returns. He is consistent in his lack of interference (MOSTLY) not interacting with many, and all of it fairly cryptic (by what we’ve seen), not even defending himself from Ben, putting the CHOICE before Ben of killing him or not.
Maybe his hands off attitude is irritating–but maybe he is relying on INDIVIDUALS to do the right thing because of who THEY are, not because Jacob tells them to.
Although he sure has prodded things along! A slight push here, a message there, a request–I need you to do this for me. And he has some quality that people do as he asks.
And he picks people as candidates who are flawed, but so very human, with potential for greatness. IMO.
So, we’ll see.
more Jacob–
Maybe there’s been a series of concessions won from MIB by Jacob as time has marched on. They have an Argument, and are at an impasse. One can’t leave because of the other, and one won’t leave so that the other HAS to stay. Both refuse to concede the point to the other. But MIB CAN’T directly kill Jacob or a ‘Candidate’. Hmm, how did that come to be? Part of the original argument, or something that came to be over time? Because Jacob made some point or other which MIB agreed to? I’d like to know that.
And what does it take to WIN this argument? “It only ends once.” Will it turn out that MIB has to concede the point for it to END? He seems kinda stubborn and tricksy for that, but hey, it could happen.
I think the rest of the story goes like this….MIB succeeds in getting the rest of the candidates killed everyone, the island sinks, the timelines mesh whilst everyone in FSW ‘remembers’ the original timeline, they get together in FSW to ‘course correct’ and put MIB back in the bottle and the island is raised and there is a new Jacob…likely Jack or Aaron.
[quote comment=”374081″]I think the rest of the story goes like this….MIB succeeds in getting the rest of the candidates killed everyone, the island sinks, the timelines mesh whilst everyone in FSW ‘remembers’ the original timeline, they get together in FSW to ‘course correct’ and put MIB back in the bottle and the island is raised and there is a new Jacob…likely Jack or Aaron.[/quote]
the whole raising the island sounds to complicated. i am still leaning to an ending with a shot of Jack/des’ eye and the feeling of “oh he knows whats going on” as in this isn’t really “the end” but the penultimate attempt before the REAL end. (the real end being getting everything right)
sort of like how the episode titled “Happily Ever After” was ANYTHING but…
technically I would prefer something more open ended but hey anyone’s guess goes…
I just had a doozy of an epiphany:
Jacob has always been seen on the island wearing white, right? right.
In every scene off the island he is seen wearing…..BLACK…or brown but darker colors nonetheless.
What if Jacob is actually the body of MIB? Jacob stole MIB’s original body. Jacob in Black (JIB) when seen off island is in fact MIB attempting to get everyone to the island so that he can manipulate events that would end his existence on the island..thus getting him “home”?
..don’t know how to properly articulate my theory but basically dwell on the fact that:
JACOB OFF THE ISLAND ALWAYS WEARS DARK COLORS.
[quote comment=”374083″]I just had a doozy of an epiphany:
Jacob has always been seen on the island wearing white, right? right.
In every scene off the island he is seen wearing…..BLACK…or brown but darker colors nonetheless.
What if Jacob is actually the body of MIB? Jacob stole MIB’s original body. Jacob in Black (JIB) when seen off island is in fact MIB attempting to get everyone to the island so that he can manipulate events that would end his existence on the island..thus getting him “home”?
..don’t know how to properly articulate my theory but basically dwell on the fact that:
JACOB OFF THE ISLAND ALWAYS WEARS DARK COLORS.[/quote]
OR, BECAUSE MIB CAN ASSUME THE BODY OF DEAD FOLKS…HE IS ASSUMING JACOBS IDENTITY OFF THE ISLAND.
A few questions I have seen and not answered!
1. I think MIB is going to go finish off Widmore’s team and he does have Claire with him who could help him kill the other candidates. I don’t think she will in the long run.
2. I think Sayid’s transformation came after talking to Desmond. Desmond asked him about Nadia and I think that brought him around…so he did die with a good heart.
3. I am not sure HOW they are going to kill MIB, but I do think Richard, or Widmore are going to know how…or we are going to see the appearance of Jacob again who will tell Hurley…it could also be that Jack, who seems to have an inner peace about what to do, will somehow know what to do…maybe the island will show him!
3. We will see the rest of the group reunite again…Richard, Miles and Ben will meet up with Jack, Hurley, Kate and Sawyer who will have rescued Desmond who will hopefully explain to them what he knows.
4. Could be interesting if the skeleton’s were Jin and Sun, but I still think it is going to be someone else…When they were first found Jack said they were older than I think they would be if it were Sun and Jin! But anything is possible!
5. Desmond is some how going to help them mesh the two timelines…not sure if that will have something to do with the destruction of MIB!
6. Finally, I do like the idea that the kid in the jungle is important and it is important that HE is getting older…could we be dealing with reincarnation? Amazing things are about to surface!
[quote comment=”374037″]
Besides possibly the religion of devil-worship, what other religion teaches that the devil is a friend to humanity??
[/quote]
Not hard to answer.
I think most of the Christian religions and especially Catholics have basically taken the side of Satan (evil);
Look at all the Billions in Pay offs the Church has to make to pay for all the decades of child abuse…and that’s just what’s been uncovered! Tip of the Ice Pick.
The lack of the Church to take any sort of stand against Hitler while he killed millions of Jews…
need one go on?
If it were an Evil contest between Satan Worshipers and Organized “Christians” with their Inquisitions of murder, and witch burnings…it would be a joke.
A great Quote from a Woody Allen film;
“If Jesus came back today he’s never stop puking from all the the things done in His name.”
Hope that was helpful….you know it’s true.
[quote comment=”374083″]I just had a doozy of an epiphany:
Jacob has always been seen on the island wearing white, right? right.
In every scene off the island he is seen wearing…..BLACK…or brown but darker colors nonetheless.
What if Jacob is actually the body of MIB? Jacob stole MIB’s original body. Jacob in Black (JIB) when seen off island is in fact MIB attempting to get everyone to the island so that he can manipulate events that would end his existence on the island..thus getting him “home”?
..don’t know how to properly articulate my theory but basically dwell on the fact that:
JACOB OFF THE ISLAND ALWAYS WEARS DARK COLORS.[/quote]
I guess it depends on whether you think MIB is restrained in a “physical” sense or in a “spiritual” sense. As in if all the MIB has to do is kill the candidates and hitch a ride off the island or if its a sort of supernatural struggle for control or souls/humanity/world etc…
[quote comment=”373897″]So, I’m thinking Richard, Miles & Co. rigged the plane, not Widmore.[/quote]
After Lock shot plane guards, he removed a watch off one of their wrists, and that watch is the timer on the bomb, so we know Locke did it..
I dont get this needs to “blow up” the airplane to disable it. With a modern aircraft like that, all you need to do is screw up the avionics inside the cockpit, smash some screens, pull some wires, and that big bird is grounded for good. No one on the island can fix this. This isn’t a little propeller plane.
Same with the sub if you think about it…
[quote comment=”373966″]MIB: “We can’t get on the plane. It’s a confined area, enclosed space that Widmore would have us trapped in. Instead, let’s GET IN THE SUBMARINE.” Losties: “Ok”. Me: (cringe).[/quote]
along with the comment “widmore wants us on the plane that’s why no (can’t remember what they’re called) electric gizmos are surrounding it… well, there were no electric gizmos surrounding the sub, so why didn’t the same logic apply… and what was up with all that swimming/carrying their rifles into the waters unprotected being no problem…
[quote comment=”373972″]I really don’t know what to expect with the last episodes. But here are some of my differing ideas.
1. I almost 100% believe that MIB is evil and Jacob is good. But what if the twist is that MIB is good. What if MIB is really looking out for everyone and is killing everyone just to get them all back to their true life (the FSW). He knows that they won’t really be dead if his plan works, even if it takes 100’s of yrs. That’s why as Locke talking in his sleep he said I wish you would have trusted me.
2. Flocke will fly the plane off the island. Locke’s memories from FSW will sink up with Flocke’s and when he gets off the island it will be the last needed change to get back to FSW.
3. I don’t think Jack stays on the island because in the FSW he’s in LA. I don’t think anyone replaced Jacob, or at least stays on the island as a replacement.
4. Or if Flocke is really evil, Jack is the one who figures out exactly how to fix everything from Des’s visions.
5. If all Flocke had to do was kill the candidates, why didn’t he have hem get on the plane? The bomb would have killed them. Unless they all need to die and then him leave the island? Or he needs one alive and leave with that person?[/quote]
Locke would have brokewn the rules if they died on the plane from a bomb he set… on the sub, he didn’t set the bomb to explode, Sawyer did by pulling the wire, hense Sawyer would have killed them (“kill each other”) not Locke… maybe the way to stop Locke is to force/intimidate him into actually killing a candidate (Hugo, Jack, or Sawyer may deliberately get into his face to challenge Locke to kill him, and he will and hence destroy himself
[quote comment=”373990″]When Locke was in the hospital talking in his sleep, saying that they needed to push the button, and that he wishes “you” would have believed me…. I thought it went back to previous seasons when the hatch blew up after the button wasn’t pushed (which started all the ff, fsw, fb…), and Jack not believing him and leaving th eisland the first time around. BUT, it was LOCKE speaking, very different from FLOCKE speaking.[/quote]
thinking MIB is the energy field (personified) the button held at bay, the button is the cork, the cavern (or whatever) where the energy is bottled up..
[quote comment=”373949″]I also thought that they could have put the C4 in the torpedo tubes, but the shock caused by the torpedo tube firing would detonate the explosive (just stomping on C4 hard enough will cause it to explode!) I also thought that they could have put the C4 in the torpedo tubes, but the shock caused by the torpedo tube firing would detonate the explosive (just stomping on C4 hard enough will cause it to explode!) …
forgot to add that the C4 has to be hot to detonate from shock so i guess the tubes would have worked, if they had enough time.[/quote]
———
C-4 is very stable and insensitive to physical shocks. Detonation can only be initiated by a combination of extreme heat and a shock wave, as when a detonator inserted into it is fired. C4 cannot be detonated by a gunshot or by dropping it onto a hard surface. It does not explode when lit on fire or exposed to microwave radiation. A small sample may be used like (toxic) sterno fuel. Anecdotal accounts from Viet Nam have individuals trying to stomp out flaming samples, initiating minor percussive event.
Heya, I have read this blog for 6 years, never commented so and it’s pretty prolific so if somebody has said this already don’t shoot me but…
Ben seemed absolutely sure that everyone will die on the island, he made that point, quite clearly, so I think that the candidate, may in fact die also. They will all die. It doesn’t mean they’re gone, they’re in the other timeline, which is going to become interesting how that resolves.
Does anyone agree? I just have such a strong memory of that statement being so strong, like a given from Ben. “They’re all going to die”
To prepare for the finale I am re-watching every episode of Lost ever. I just watched episode 13 of Season 3 “The Man From Tallahasse” and in this episode John Locke destroys the Other’s submarine with C-4 because he never wants to leave the island. I found this ironic because the last episode he tried to kill everyone with C-4 while they were on a submarine. I thought that to be quite interesting.Fun fact
[quote comment=”374094″]Heya, I have read this blog for 6 years, never commented so and it’s pretty prolific so if somebody has said this already don’t shoot me but…
Ben seemed absolutely sure that everyone will die on the island, he made that point, quite clearly, so I think that the candidate, may in fact die also. They will all die. It doesn’t mean they’re gone, they’re in the other timeline, which is going to become interesting how that resolves.
Does anyone agree? I just have such a strong memory of that statement being so strong, like a given from Ben. “They’re all going to die”[/quote]
When did he say this exactly? I thought it was more of a reaction to the MIB escaping the island or Jacobs death/apparent defeat…
[quote comment=”374096″][quote comment=”374094″]Heya, I have read this blog for 6 years, never commented so and it’s pretty prolific so if somebody has said this already don’t shoot me but…
Ben seemed absolutely sure that everyone will die on the island, he made that point, quite clearly, so I think that the candidate, may in fact die also. They will all die. It doesn’t mean they’re gone, they’re in the other timeline, which is going to become interesting how that resolves.
Does anyone agree? I just have such a strong memory of that statement being so strong, like a given from Ben. “They’re all going to die”[/quote]
When did he say this exactly? I thought it was more of a reaction to the MIB escaping the island or Jacobs death/apparent defeat…[/quote]
Without being specific, as I’d have to go back and watch it, I think it was like season 3, at the end, quote from Wikipedia here… “He reunites Alex with her mother, and claims that if Jack contacts the freighter, every single person on the Island will die.”
And I am sure he says a “they will all die on the island” before that as well, like he knew they would.
I just remember it being so strong it’s stuck with me right through the whole series…
[quote comment=”374096″][quote comment=”374094″]Heya, I have read this blog for 6 years, never commented so and it’s pretty prolific so if somebody has said this already don’t shoot me but…
Ben seemed absolutely sure that everyone will die on the island, he made that point, quite clearly, so I think that the candidate, may in fact die also. They will all die. It doesn’t mean they’re gone, they’re in the other timeline, which is going to become interesting how that resolves.
Does anyone agree? I just have such a strong memory of that statement being so strong, like a given from Ben. “They’re all going to die”[/quote]
When did he say this exactly? I thought it was more of a reaction to the MIB escaping the island or Jacobs death/apparent defeat…[/quote]
I agree. I think Ben said it to Jack very matter of factly. Then he went about his business.
Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?
Is this the MIB off the island preparing Locke to learn how to fly a plane so that when the MIB wants to get off the island, then Locke (MIB) will know how to fly it?
Or am I missing something?
I was standing by the thought that the flash sideways is how things were after the plane landed (without crash but with island experience). Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?
[quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?
Is this the MIB off the island preparing Locke to learn how to fly a plane so that when the MIB wants to get off the island, then Locke (MIB) will know how to fly it?
Or am I missing something?
I was standing by the thought that the flash sideways is how things were after the plane landed (without crash but with island experience). Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?[/quote]
Would it be due to the effects of the losties being in the 70’s and the explosion, that changed everyone in the FSW.
I kind of got the feeling that he might have been lying about it as he didn’t want to say what really happened. He was not all that convincing 🙂
I’m surprised nothing happened to FLocke when Jack pushed him in the water. Isn’t he not allowed in the water at all? Or am I interpreting that incorrectly?
[quote comment=”374100″][quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?…
… Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?[/quote]
Would it be due to the effects of the losties being in the 70’s and the explosion, that changed everyone in the FSW.
I kind of got the feeling that he might have been lying about it as he didn’t want to say what really happened. He was not all that convincing :)[/quote][/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
I thought that, too, because there’s still what Cooper did to James’ family. I think that’s going to unfold before the end–that’s always been John’s problem, WANTING to believe, wanting his father’s love and acceptance, and not being able to let that go in the face of reality. Going to the well, so to speak, even though it’s dry. Cooper just never had any good, any love in him, and I’d find it hard to believe that he’d changed in FSW especially considering how close others kept to their orig persona.
Wouldn’t it be ironic if MIB got off the Island only to be trapped in Anthony Cooper’s body?
Jacob, again
I have to apologize, because I watched the end of Ab Aeterno again, and Jacob lays out the Argument straight up. da-uh. “That man who sent you to kill me believes that everyone is corruptible because it’s in their very nature to sin. I bring people here to prove him wrong.”
So maybe those 2 are guardians at the gates of Hell. And MIB is tired of his job.
It’s interesting to see how Jacob has changed–he starts out bringing people to the island and doesn’t interfere at all–they should know the difference between right and wrong without him telling them.
Then he ‘hires’ Richard to be his representative to people (since if you don’t, HE will)
And then we see him actually reaching out to our folks–still not ‘interfering’ by telling them what to do or not do, but connecting with the ones who he hopes will take his place
Island at the Bottom of the Sea–uh, disturbing.
[quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?
Is this the MIB off the island preparing Locke to learn how to fly a plane so that when the MIB wants to get off the island, then Locke (MIB) will know how to fly it?
Or am I missing something?
I was standing by the thought that the flash sideways is how things were after the plane landed (without crash but with island experience). Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?[/quote]
Well, alot of things have been different, and we dont really know why that is… but my guess is that you have the old butterfly effect… if you change one thing, you change a whole series of things… the bomb in the 70’s was supposed to change things.
But also I have my theory of MIB being able to control Locke at times… like how Desmond went back in time in his head and changed his fate with Penny. Anthony Cooper is still the same, but maybe he got buddy buddy with Locke because MIB could deliver certain “information”… to Anthony Cooper, through Locke, and so he decided not to push Locke out a window and spend more quality father time….
[quote comment=”374101″]I’m surprised nothing happened to FLocke when Jack pushed him in the water. Isn’t he not allowed in the water at all? Or am I interpreting that incorrectly?[/quote]
**************
I think it was to buy them some time, and he can’t turn into smoke monster in the water…he is ok in human form!
[quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?
Is this the MIB off the island preparing Locke to learn how to fly a plane so that when the MIB wants to get off the island, then Locke (MIB) will know how to fly it?
[/quote]
Very nice idea about MIB inheriting from Locke the knowledge of flying a plane. Is this why he didn’t let the plane blew up?
[quote comment=”374102″][quote comment=”374100″][quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?…
… Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?[/quote]
Would it be due to the effects of the losties being in the 70’s and the explosion, that changed everyone in the FSW.
I kind of got the feeling that he might have been lying about it as he didn’t want to say what really happened. He was not all that convincing :)[/quote][/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
I thought that, too, because there’s still what Cooper did to James’ family. I think that’s going to unfold before the end–that’s always been John’s problem, WANTING to believe, wanting his father’s love and acceptance, and not being able to let that go in the face of reality. Going to the well, so to speak, even though it’s dry. Cooper just never had any good, any love in him, and I’d find it hard to believe that he’d changed in FSW especially considering how close others kept to their orig persona.
Wouldn’t it be ironic if MIB got off the Island only to be trapped in Anthony Cooper’s body?[/quote]
But other things are different, too. Jack has a son being a big one. Ben getting along with and taking care of his dad another. Sun and Jin not married, Desmond not knowing Penny and getting along with Mr. Widmore (did he still join the army?), Hurley being Lucky,… As far as Anthony Cooper, we know that when Sawyer looked up the name he got lots of matches. Maybe this time around Locke’s dad is NOT the bad Anthony Cooper?
[quote comment=”374083″]I just had a doozy of an epiphany:
Jacob has always been seen on the island wearing white, right? right.
In every scene off the island he is seen wearing…..BLACK…or brown but darker colors nonetheless.
What if Jacob is actually the body of MIB? Jacob stole MIB’s original body. Jacob in Black (JIB) when seen off island is in fact MIB attempting to get everyone to the island so that he can manipulate events that would end his existence on the island..thus getting him “home”?
..don’t know how to properly articulate my theory but basically dwell on the fact that:
JACOB OFF THE ISLAND ALWAYS WEARS DARK COLORS.[/quote]
Did Jacob ALWAYS wear dark colors off island? I thought it was only when he visited the LIB (Llana in Bandages) and I thought that maybe it was because of where he was that maybe he had to wear a disguise?
[quote comment=”374106″][quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?
Is this the MIB off the island preparing Locke to learn how to fly a plane so that when the MIB wants to get off the island, then Locke (MIB) will know how to fly it?
[/quote]
Very nice idea about MIB inheriting from Locke the knowledge of flying a plane. Is this why he didn’t let the plane blew up?[/quote]
***********
Maybe the timelines are going to mesh and as MIB is destroyed and the two timelines converge, 2004 Locke will somehow “retake” over his island body and be the person who flies them back off the island.
My take on the plane during this episode was that MIB was trying to convince our losties to trust him and make Widmore out to be the bad guy. He somewhat gained their trust, convinced them they needed to take the sub (which wasn’t hard as this was how Sawyer planned to get off the island all the time) and he duped them into getting on the sub with the C-4.
I think Jack was right when he said they would be ok. It was just like the dynomite on the black Rock; it didn’t go off. But MIB hoped one of them would panic and try to disarm it (as sawyer did) and so his plan worked~but didn’t kill all of them~ and somehow he sensed that!
[quote comment=”374108″][quote comment=”374083″]I just had a doozy of an epiphany:
Jacob has always been seen on the island wearing white, right? right.
In every scene off the island he is seen wearing…..BLACK…or brown but darker colors nonetheless.
What if Jacob is actually the body of MIB? Jacob stole MIB’s original body. Jacob in Black (JIB) when seen off island is in fact MIB attempting to get everyone to the island so that he can manipulate events that would end his existence on the island..thus getting him “home”?
..don’t know how to properly articulate my theory but basically dwell on the fact that:
JACOB OFF THE ISLAND ALWAYS WEARS DARK COLORS.[/quote]
Did Jacob ALWAYS wear dark colors off island? I thought it was only when he visited the LIB (Llana in Bandages) and I thought that maybe it was because of where he was that maybe he had to wear a disguise?[/quote]
**************
From a few pics on Lostpedia, Jacob is definitely in dark colors. Not sure if they are BLACK. Don’t you think he would look funny in some of the scenes if he were wearing his island garb (white). He is in a suit when he sees Sawyer, The Kwons and Jack. The suit would be appropriate for the wedding and the funeral and would look pretty funny if he were wearing all white. Not sure if it is significant or not, but his clothing seems to fit in order for him to blend in and not stick out like a sore thumb.
Correct me if im crazy, but maybe Smokey has been Flocke when he wanted to, maybe certain times he knew Locke was on his own or with other people he would mingle with the other Losties, hence why sometimes John Locke new it was going to rain or said strange things. Maybe what we are watching is a year or two before the crash and if Smokey isnt killed at the end he could be Flocke, even though there is a real John Locke alive on the island… nevermind, I cant explain in words 😦
Also, what are y’all’s thoughts on Richard once telling some of the Losties “I saw you all die” ? Not sure which episode it was but they ran into him on the beach, maybe we are suppossed to forget that and it will happen on last episode? or things changed that timeline? Either way it either has to happen or that was a stupid thing for the writers to put in IMO.
[quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?
Is this the MIB off the island preparing Locke to learn how to fly a plane so that when the MIB wants to get off the island, then Locke (MIB) will know how to fly it?
Or am I missing something?
I was standing by the thought that the flash sideways is how things were after the plane landed (without crash but with island experience). Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?[/quote]
so that good ol’ flashsideways Sawyer can find reason not to follow through on his life’s purpose of killing him, as he sees coop already punished, while at the same time our not feeling Sawyer to be a guy who gives up easily on that purpose and thereupon breaking his character…
[quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?
Is this the MIB off the island preparing Locke to learn how to fly a plane so that when the MIB wants to get off the island, then Locke (MIB) will know how to fly it?
Or am I missing something?
I was standing by the thought that the flash sideways is how things were after the plane landed (without crash but with island experience). Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?[/quote]
so that good ol’ flashsideways Sawyer can find reason not to follow through on his life’s purpose of killing him, as he sees coop already punished, while at the same time our not feeling Sawyer to be a guy who gives up easily on that purpose and thereupon breaking his character…
[quote comment=”374111″]Correct me if im crazy, but maybe Smokey has been Flocke when he wanted to, maybe certain times he knew Locke was on his own or with other people he would mingle with the other Losties, hence why sometimes John Locke new it was going to rain or said strange things. Maybe what we are watching is a year or two before the crash and if Smokey isnt killed at the end he could be Flocke, even though there is a real John Locke alive on the island… nevermind, I cant explain in words :([/quote]
yea, makes sense, always seemed weird to me that immediately upon being able to walk some clerk with just third hand studying was suddenly so skillful in application as a wilderness guy
I think its like the writer’s intent with the original Crisis stories in comics, or even JJ’s Star Trek, let the bomb upset the continuem so that subsequent holes in the full storyline (continuity) can be explained away by it… (and let’s be honest, many of Lost’s ‘mindboggling’ concepts that the general public consider original, comic readers know were in comics years before Lost…)
[quote comment=”374107″][quote comment=”374102″][quote comment=”374100″][quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?……
I kind of got the feeling that he might have been lying about it as he didn’t want to say what really happened. He was not all that convincing :)[/quote][/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
I thought that, too, because there’s still what Cooper did to James’ family. I think that’s going to unfold before the end–that’s always been John’s problem, WANTING to believe, wanting his father’s love and acceptance, and not being able to let that go in the face of reality. Going to the well, so to speak, even though it’s dry. Cooper just never had any good, any love in him, and I’d find it hard to believe that he’d changed in FSW especially considering how close others kept to their orig persona.
Wouldn’t it be ironic if MIB got off the Island only to be trapped in Anthony Cooper’s body?[/quote]
But other things are different, too. Jack has a son being a big one. Ben getting along with and taking care of his dad another. Sun and Jin not married, Desmond not knowing Penny and getting along with Mr. Widmore (did he still join the army?), Hurley being Lucky,… As far as Anthony Cooper, we know that when Sawyer looked up the name he got lots of matches. Maybe this time around Locke’s dad is NOT the bad Anthony Cooper?[/quote][/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
mmm, yes and no–they may have different circumstances–like Jack having a son, Ben getting along with his dad, etc.–but they are still, well, better versions of themselves yet recognizable as THEM. The Cooper John tells us about is so far removed from what we know about him, it just isn’t meshing for me. He NEVER repented. So I think there has to be more to John’s tale than he’s saying.
[quote comment=”374117″]
mmm, yes and no–they may have different circumstances–like Jack having a son, Ben getting along with his dad, etc.–but they are still, well, better versions of themselves yet recognizable as THEM. The Cooper John tells us about is so far removed from what we know about him, it just isn’t meshing for me. He NEVER repented. So I think there has to be more to John’s tale than he’s saying.[/quote]
Yes. For better? Or for worse? —maybe Anthony Cooper just had Locke fooled all along, rather then Locke figuring out that he was scammed… or maybe John Locke is just fooling himself, making it easier for him to blame himself and forget what things had been done to him in the past.
I said before, we dont have enough back story in the alt time line. Do we know if Locke has both kidneys?
—In any sense I have to agree with what mikemarks said about Sawyer not being able to kill him now and I think that might be more of the point. I’d have to think that Sawyer would lose that kill-lust once he finds out that Coopers a vegetable.
[quote comment=”374107″][quote comment=”374102″][quote comment=”374100″][quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?…
… Plus, along with the flash sideways, everyone’s flashback would mesh with the flash sideways timeline. So, the flashbacks came first in sequence and then followed by the flash sideways. Next, in sequence would be MIB off the island with possibly most or all of the losties dead. However, the two different stories of Locke’s paralysis incident has thrown me a curve ball.
Why the two stories?[/quote]
Would it be due to the effects of the losties being in the 70’s and the explosion, that changed everyone in the FSW.
I kind of got the feeling that he might have been lying about it as he didn’t want to say what really happened. He was not all that convincing :)[/quote][/quote]
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I thought that, too, because there’s still what Cooper did to James’ family. I think that’s going to unfold before the end–that’s always been John’s problem, WANTING to believe, wanting his father’s love and acceptance, and not being able to let that go in the face of reality. Going to the well, so to speak, even though it’s dry. Cooper just never had any good, any love in him, and I’d find it hard to believe that he’d changed in FSW especially considering how close others kept to their orig persona.
Wouldn’t it be ironic if MIB got off the Island only to be trapped in Anthony Cooper’s body?[/quote]
But other things are different, too. Jack has a son being a big one. Ben getting along with and taking care of his dad another. Sun and Jin not married, Desmond not knowing Penny and getting along with Mr. Widmore (did he still join the army?), Hurley being Lucky,… As far as Anthony Cooper, we know that when Sawyer looked up the name he got lots of matches. Maybe this time around Locke’s dad is NOT the bad Anthony Cooper?[/quote]
Oh yeah, sweet! Thanks a lot for pointing those things out. On to next theory! HA HA! Gotta love Lost!
FYI:
Police shoot out at Walt’s home!
http://www.tmz.com/2010/05/07/lost-walt-malcolm-david-kelley-robbery-gun-shots-arrest-shooting/
I love reading this blog and have been doing so since the beginning. Great ideas everyone! Did anyone else find it interesting that in FSW Locke takes on the burden of believing he “killed” his father by crashing the plane? Remember on the island, Ben brought Anthony Cooper to the island and told Locke he need to kill AC to proove he was fit for leadership (or something to that effect). He couldn’t kill him but Sawyer came and did it and Locke brought the body back to camp as if he did it. I found this interesting.
Flock strikes again!!!
My comment was in response to the TMZ story
FYI:
Police shoot out at Walt’s home!
http://www.tmz.com/2010/05/07/lost-walt-malcolm-david-kelley-robbery-gun-shots-arrest-shooting/
[quote comment=”373905″][quote comment=”373903″][quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
Good point! If all the candidates are dead, Flocke could leave on the plane, but now that Lapidus is dead, who would fly it?[/quote]
Just spit balling here…but he didn’t need an explosives tech to build a bomb…go figure.
Another thought….maybe he doesn’t need a vessel to leave at all once all the candidates are dead and there is no one keeping him.[/quote]
[quote comment=”374125″][quote comment=”373905″][quote comment=”373903″][quote comment=”373900″]Bedtime for Bonzo:
If MIB needed them to die…why didn’t he just let them die on the plane?
Because he is still going to use the plane….no?[/quote]
Good point! If all the candidates are dead, Flocke could leave on the plane, but now that Lapidus is dead, who would fly it?[/quote]
Just spit balling here…but he didn’t need an explosives tech to build a bomb…go figure.
Another thought….maybe he doesn’t need a vessel to leave at all once all the candidates are dead and there is no one keeping him.[/quote][/quote]
How about this idea. After all of the candidates die, the island will sink and Jacob and MIB will die with the sinking of the island. MIB is not trying to off the island, but just wants to die and take Jacob with him.
It seems to me unfair for any candidate to replace Jacob (they all want to live their own lives except perhaps from original Locke who wanted to stay).
[quote comment=”374117″][quote comment=”374107″][quote comment=”374102″][quote comment=”374100″][quote comment=”374099″]Does anyone have any thoughts as to why the flashback Locke paralysis incident (father pushing him out the window) is so different from the flash sideways incident (plane crash Locke was piloting and now his father is a vegetable)?……
I kind of got the feeling that he might have been lying about it as he didn’t want to say what really happened. He was not all that convincing :)[/quote][/quote]
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I thought that, too, because there’s still what Cooper did to James’ family. I think that’s going to unfold before the end–that’s always been John’s problem, WANTING to believe, wanting his father’s love and acceptance, and not being able to let that go in the face of reality. Going to the well, so to speak, even though it’s dry. Cooper just never had any good, any love in him, and I’d find it hard to believe that he’d changed in FSW especially considering how close others kept to their orig persona.
Wouldn’t it be ironic if MIB got off the Island only to be trapped in Anthony Cooper’s body?[/quote]
But other things are different, too. Jack has a son being a big one. Ben getting along with and taking care of his dad another. Sun and Jin not married, Desmond not knowing Penny and getting along with Mr. Widmore (did he still join the army?), Hurley being Lucky,… As far as Anthony Cooper, we know that when Sawyer looked up the name he got lots of matches. Maybe this time around Locke’s dad is NOT the bad Anthony Cooper?[/quote][/quote]
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mmm, yes and no–they may have different circumstances–like Jack having a son, Ben getting along with his dad, etc.–but they are still, well, better versions of themselves yet recognizable as THEM. The Cooper John tells us about is so far removed from what we know about him, it just isn’t meshing for me. He NEVER repented. So I think there has to be more to John’s tale than he’s saying.[/quote]
could john have crashed the plane on purpose hoping to kill his (still bad) father and himself
how can Jack be sure that the island wouldn’t kill him when he killed the candidate Kwon?… though maybe it didn’t, maybe when we seen their hands depart the pilot was in there dragging Mr. Kwon to … also, since there was a chance they wouldn’t have tampered with the C4 timer and therefore it wouldn’t have went off, there was the chance that they could have successfully gotten away from the island and Locke, how/why would Locke give them that chance?
sorry for posting so much but reading these blogs has got my mind rolling… if Jin was sterile that would make their child similar to a Jesus virgin birth… apparently the pregnancy etc. experiments they were doing was the act of trying to find a child who would grow into significence (FLocke?) be it Kwon’s, Arron, or the mystery kids… the show has established that a single entity can exist as two beings simultaneously ((island version/sideways version) so what if all the characters are divisions of a single entity? That all the candidates may merge all their individual characteristics into a single quality successor to Jacob, existing as that single entity in the island universe yet getting to live their individual lives in the sideways universe? I believe counting the Kwons as one makes 6 candidates, counting them as two makes 7 candidates, so merged as a single entity 6 can represent evil and 7 can represent good perserving the enternal conflict between dark and light… one thing I don’t remember: did pregnancy on the island result in the deaths of both mother and child, or just mother?
ok, now I’m really wacking out, currently watching scene where dez pulls charlie from car underwater… it occurs to me that among dez’s qualities is his struggle to snatch life from death, a quality that would be part of any singularity all the losties might compose as an ‘all-being’… life may avoid death, maybe forever, but still death is there to struggle with or surrender to… Charlie may be “Life” and dez the eternal conflict/struggle between Life and Death (existence or nonexistence?)… cool that the show even makes us think of such things and if we’re lucky a stimulous for good conversation…
ok, now I’m up to scene same episode where dez talks to faradaymusician… what if Smokey has already been stopped, when the nuke detonated it destroyed him, and now all the realities he affected are just imploding to straightened themselves..?
I’ll try to make this the last one, but like I said, my mind is rolling and I gotta put it down somewhere… if all the losties are indeed cells of a single body existing as One to oppose some Other in eternal conflict/balance occuring on some ‘prime’ world (the island), yet as cells they claim their individual lives as well, my prediction for final scene: they lift into the sky (or whatever) to merge themselves into the One-All Being (Like StarTrekVigorDecker)and within the miste of that Being we see each find their individual happinesses (like StarTrekNexus)Sawyer coming home to Julie, the other couples coming together, the Kwons, Sayid and Claudia, Charlie and Clair, Dez and Penny, Libby and Hugo, Ben and his daughter, of course Jack and Kate (and unlike StarTrekNexus, all loved ones are real)
[quote comment=”374122″] Remember on the island, Ben brought Anthony Cooper to the island and told Locke he need to kill AC to proove he was fit for leadership (or something to that effect). He couldn’t kill him but Sawyer came and did it and Locke brought the body back to camp as if he did it. I found this interesting.[/quote]
I’ve thought about that too. At the time it just reinforced the idea that the Others were bad. I also felt Ben wanted to stop John from becoming the new leader and if he killed his father perhaps Jacob wouldn’t be happy with him therefore disqualifying Locke. Ben didn’t want his position to be taken away from him. Locke couldn’t kill his own father despite what Cooper had done to him so he got Sawyer. He knew Sawyer wouldn’t have any problem doing it. From what we’ve seen in the flashbacks, John forgave his father. John believed it was his destiny and if his father dying was the price to pay, then so be it. As you said, he acted as if he had done the deed himself. Another deception on Locke’s part after his first encounter with Smokey.
Now it seems like a foreshadowing of Ben killing Locke and Jacob for the MIB. The whole idea of getting someone else to do the killing for you. Things have come full circle in a sense.
OK mikemarks, now I think you are driving yourself crazy, just like the rest of us. hehe
The possibilities are endless. I for one hope the ending is a total surprise.
I’m anxiously awaiting to find out WHO the boy in the jungle is and WHY he has blood on his hands. In that scene was he telling MIB that he has blood on HIS hands for having Jacob killed? Whoever the boy is, did he murder someone? Does it have anything to do with MIB saying that Jacob stole his body?
[quote comment=”374101″]I’m surprised nothing happened to FLocke when Jack pushed him in the water. Isn’t he not allowed in the water at all? Or am I interpreting that incorrectly?[/quote]
I’m wondering if all of that was a lie. Nothing happened to him when Jack shoved him into the water. Back in S1 one of the times Jack saw the “ghost” of his father, he was standing in the water at the beach.
I think we will see Walt or hear an explanation about his special abilities. That was an important part of the story. When Locke left the island to bring them all back, he met Walt but when Abaddon asked John about Walt, he said “He’s been through enough already”. Bea Klugh said that they (the Others) got more than they bargained for with Walt.
I keep thinking what Michael said to Hurley. The whispers were from people that couldn’t move on. He was there because of what he had done. Didn’t Michael redeem himself on the freighter? Does he and the other whisperers have to wait until it all ends to move on?
make your own kind of music
[quote comment=”374138″][quote comment=”374101″]I’m surprised nothing happened to FLocke when Jack pushed him in the water. Isn’t he not allowed in the water at all? Or am I interpreting that incorrectly?[/quote]
I’m wondering if all of that was a lie. Nothing happened to him when Jack shoved him into the water. Back in S1 one of the times Jack saw the “ghost” of his father, he was standing in the water at the beach.[/quote]
He can’t be in the water as the smoke monster. Ben could invite Smokie in the barracks if only he had drained the mud water in the secret chamber under his house. The water was something like a cork for that hole. That’s why he can’t fly off the island as a smoke monster. Because he is surrounded by water.
So, is the island the cork or the other way around?
[quote comment=”374025″]Post #11 and #56 I’ve been thinking about these things for awhile now. I still think there’s some meaning behind the psychic’s words. The crazy mother theme is meaningful too.
All along it was obvious MIB intended to have all the remaining candidates killed. I never believed he wanted them all to leave with him. He’s a liar and a manipulator. We saw Kate’s name crossed out on the dial in the Lighthouse, so what Sawyer told her about the cave wasn’t a surprise. Not sure about Claire but I would assume she was no longer a candidate either. Kate is still around to influence Jack and Sawyer’s decisions (whether it’s MIB or Widmore)so she’s useful for now. Does anyone else feel there’s an underlying reason Flocke is protecting Claire? IS it because of Aaron or does MIB need her for the time being such as to influence Kate? I don’t think it’s because she reminds him of his mommy.[/quote]
The cave says Shephard. Claire could be The Candidate, not Jack.
The mirror in the music box was like the mirror in the lighthouse. Jacob watched them both.
[quote comment=”374126″][quote comment=”374125″][quote comment=”373905″][quote comment=”373903″][quote comment=”373900″][/quote]
Another thought….maybe he doesn’t need a vessel to leave at all once all the candidates are dead and there is no one keeping him.[/quote][/quote]
How about this idea. After all of the candidates die, the island will sink and Jacob and MIB will die with the sinking of the island. MIB is not trying to off the island, but just wants to die and take Jacob with him.[/quote]
Maybe, I think the writers have hinted to us several times that evil is on the way if things go ‘correctly’. So IMO, he doesn’t want to die, he wants to escape the island’s grip.
[quote comment=”374138″][quote comment=”374101″]I’m surprised nothing happened to FLocke when Jack pushed him in the water. Isn’t he not allowed in the water at all? Or am I interpreting that incorrectly?[/quote]
I’m wondering if all of that was a lie. Nothing happened to him when Jack shoved him into the water. Back in S1 one of the times Jack saw the “ghost” of his father, he was standing in the water at the beach.[/quote]
I don’t think it’s the Wicked Witch I’m Melting type of thing. He can get wet with no problem, he just can’t travel across water in Smokie form, and in his human form he obviously needs a vessel- like every other human.
What I find interesting is that MIB had some issues with his “crazy mother”, but didn’t say anything about his dad. We have seen that theme much more with Ben, Locke, Jack and Claire, Kate (stepdad/dad), Hurley, Sun,….
[quote comment=”374146″][quote comment=”374138″][quote comment=”374101″]I’m surprised nothing happened to FLocke when Jack pushed him in the water. Isn’t he not allowed in the water at all? Or am I interpreting that incorrectly?[/quote]
I’m wondering if all of that was a lie. Nothing happened to him when Jack shoved him into the water. Back in S1 one of the times Jack saw the “ghost” of his father, he was standing in the water at the beach.[/quote]
I don’t think it’s the Wicked Witch I’m Melting type of thing. He can get wet with no problem, he just can’t travel across water in Smokie form, and in his human form he obviously needs a vessel- like every other human.[/quote]
I agree with Miraks. MIB implied that he couldn’t travel off the island in smoke form. He still hasn’t, he was pushed into the water while in Locke form…he didn’t GO anywhere.
So excited for the finale! I’m going to miss this show. I wish I could say I had my other favorite abc show “Legend of the Seeker” to watch to fill the void, but it’s sadly rumored to be canceled. Ahh well, that’s how it goes over at abc. I’m thankful Lost is going out on a high on it’s on terms.
[quote comment=”374147″]What I find interesting is that MIB had some issues with his “crazy mother”, but didn’t say anything about his dad. We have seen that theme much more with Ben, Locke, Jack and Claire, Kate (stepdad/dad), Hurley, Sun,….[/quote]
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We’ve seen a lot of the “crazy mother” theme too: Daniel/Eloise, Rouso/Alex, Kate/Her mom, Claire/Aaron, Jin/His Mom, and Walt/His Mom.
3. I don’t think in the end there will be “replacements” for Jacob and MIB. I think the “game” will end (with MIB dead?) and the island will SINK![/quote]
in the first episode of the season, didn’t they show the island under water with sharks and junk? also, who is the little boy fLocke sees in the woods all the time?
Thanks everyone. I don’t know why I thought it was both forms of MIB. It makes sense, otherwise Smokey would have flown the coop.